We have a canoe on the AT. Maybe we can have a raft too.
We have a canoe on the AT. Maybe we can have a raft too.
Yes I concur! But not alot of options here as that has been discussed, without that very dangerous rt. 340 walk south to keptryst rd to sandy hook rd, which is all very dangerous walking. It would be a very long and dangerous walk for 1 hiker not to mention 2 or more. And people would miss Hf and the ATC and not getting their picture taken, not gonna happen. Yeah quite the quagmire to be in. If folks were ok with missing Hf and the ATC and missing about 3 miles or so of the AT they could walk south on rt 340 for about 1 mile where the AT crosses under rt 340 and walk down to and continue north. But that's alot what ifs and alot to miss out on I suppose.
No need to inject politics into the thread folks. Keep it out of the thread and off the forum.
"Sleepy alligator in the noonday sun
Sleepin by the river just like he usually done
Call for his whisky
He can call for his tea
Call all he wanta but he can't call me..."
Robert Hunter & Ron McKernan
Whiteblaze.net User Agreement.
You could have a blue blaze into Harpers Ferry, as was the case before the footpath on the rail bridge was built.
There is nothing sacred about having the AT pass through Harpers Ferry’s.
There is something sacred about maintaining the AT as an unbroken pathway.
A route must be found for 2020 hikers.
The ATC is in the best position to suggest/find/build the safest one.
The Tuscarora Trail - a 252 mile re-route.
Established in the 1960's as an alternate route for the Appalachian Trail (AT), the Tuscarora Trail is a 250-mile long trail through the Ridge and Valley Appalachians of Virginia, West Virginia, Maryland and Pennsylvania. More recently, sections of the Tuscarora from Mill Mountain in West Virginia to Cove Mountain in Pennsylvania, have been included in the long-distance Great Eastern Trail. A hiking destination in its own right, the Tuscarora Trail leaves the AT near Mathews Arm Campground in Shenandoah National Park making its way west and north to rejoin the AT atop Blue Mountain, 10 miles south of Duncannon, Pa. Coupling the experience of remote wilderness, green pastures, small towns, rugged tread-way and country back roads, the Tuscarora offers a truly unique hiking adventure.
Furlough
"Too often I would hear men boast of the miles covered that day, rarely of what they had seen." Louis L’Amour
You would prefer they did not hold that concern during construction and the integrity of the pedestrian bridge in long term? Responsible entities keep that consideration high in this type of situation. Irresponsible ones do not, which is why we have collapses like the Miami pedestrian bridge and too many others to mention. I would prefer this to be done right, frankly I am not sure why anyone wouldn't.
Here is my biggest concern. And yeah, I'm one of those what-if type people when it's warranted.
Because, but for the good fortune that this event occurred at 3am on a winter night rather than 3pm on a summer day, the scene just prior to the derailment might have looked like this:
These young people are exactly why we will keep asking what-if. They are why a full assessment of not only the mechanical repair of what previously existed must be performed, but why an analysis of the derailment and how to ensure it isn't repeated must be done, and why a full reassessment of the routing itself may need to be taken into consideration as well. They are why we'll worry about the safety aspects first, and the costs and timeliness second.
Traveler, I think you might possibly have misinterpreted what George meant. Reading this thread says to me that you, George, 4eyedbuzzard are likely engineers, project managers, project accountants or procurement professionals with understanding of how government procurement works.
Trillium
Sorry I mentioned politics, I wasn't trying to start anything or sound ignorant towards safety concerns. I didn't mean what a lot of people would think of as politics either but there's some in everything... like in the building/carpentry field you have all sorts of ridiculous new codes every year because of the hardware companies. I was talking to a building inspector about how meaningless some stuff is and he shook his head and said its all these companies at their meetings pushing the importance of all these products and nobody's saying anything against it... That's just a small example of what I was getting it. I know nothing about the bridge process but figured something like that had to be going on because it does with everything, but I shouldn't of said anything and apologize.
Last edited by LazyLightning; 01-19-2020 at 12:20.
NoDoz
nobo 2018 March 10th - October 19th
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I'm just one too many mornings and 1,000 miles behind
I understand the concern with future accidents on the bridge. However railroads run through towns and cities in extremely close proximity to people everywhere, sometimes with catastrophic results, and yet they rebuild and carry on.
"Chainsaw" GA-ME 2011
How many thousands of trains and millions of people have walked over that bridge w/o incident? Life is not w/o risk. Don't try to ruin a good thing w/ hysterics.
Be Prepared
"Sleepy alligator in the noonday sun
Sleepin by the river just like he usually done
Call for his whisky
He can call for his tea
Call all he wanta but he can't call me..."
Robert Hunter & Ron McKernan
Whiteblaze.net User Agreement.
Originally Posted by rickb
There is nothing sacred about having the AT pass through Harpers Ferry’s. There is something sacred about maintaining the AT as an unbroken pathway. A route must be found for 2020 hikers. The ATC is in the best position to suggest/find/build the safest one.
Or back to my suggestion at post #52.
"Too often I would hear men boast of the miles covered that day, rarely of what they had seen." Louis L’Amour
Just found out Google Earth street view lets you walk across the bridge
This confirmed that there are stone pillers for a bridge which used to cross the river, just off to the side of the current tracks. Two of which are still intact and two which are gone. I was pretty sure I had noticed them when I crossed last year.
Rather then repair the current walkway, maybe it would be better to build a new foot bridge on the old pillers. These likely date to before the Civil war, so could be of historical significant to restore. But then, it did cost a million dollars to covert an existing RR bridge into a foot path over the James River in VA.
Follow slogoen on Instagram.
Here's some history on the bridge(s) for you - just killin' time http://www.wvculture.org/shpo/nr/pdf...n/78001484.pdf
Wow, so cool thanks so much for putting that up. Absolutely amazing what they were capable of way back then. No hydraulics, no laser assistance leveling, no concrete truck pumps. Just amazes me. Alot of pick and axe and unreliable dynamite. So if I'm reading it correctly they built a new bridge to accommodate the new speeds of trains and take out the drastic curves as well as tunneling through the mountain? And the old bridge which we can still see the concrete pillars was wiped out by the flood of 1936? And some guy named Harper used to ferry people across up 1794 ?hence harpers ferry. Thanks again for this. And how the hell did they do concrete pillars in the middle a river back then?
A little research (without links) while just killin' time. The track that the derailment occurred on is a dead ended 30+ mile secondary line that serves grain customer(s) in Winchester, VA area. Typically the railroad hauls 50 to 65 loaded grain cars there, then hauls the empties back out. It isn't a heavily used line. The curve radius at the bridge approach is somewhere between 300 and 330 feet. It meets the absolute minimum radius (288 ft) for North American rail lines but not on lines for general service. The minimum radius for general service is 410 ft. The preferred minimum on freight main lines is 574 ft.It's an old bridge (1894), and an old rail system - with sharp curves at the bridge approach that wouldn't likely be built today. Speed and tractive effort/force need to be carefully controlled on short radius curves, which is one of the theories regarding why this accident happened. Short radius curves also have increased rail maintenance and failure issues due to the force of train wheels pushing against the sides of the rails as they go around the curve.
Given that the track right next to the walkway is so infrequently used, it would seem that one possible choice that would both increase safety and expedite resolving the break in the AT footpath would be to rebuild the pedestrian bridge but simply prohibit people from being on it for the few minutes while a train was crossing. Nothing wrong with keeping moving trains and people away from each other.
Whether one agrees with this mentality or not, it will drive all future decision making. The NPS and others (not CSX) have made that clear.
The ATC does not have the luxury of hoping the footpath over the bridge will be rebuilt anytime soon.
They need to put maximum effort into an alternative route now.
Required shuttles are not a solution.
If Harpers Ferry ends up down a blue blaze, then so be it!