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  1. #1
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    Default Concern: non- free standing tent...

    My concern is places where the ground is too hard for stakes. I know you can use rocks, and you can also use water to soften the ground. I've hiked in places out west where there are no usable rocks, and where water is too scarce to waste. Has anyone experienced these issues?
    Thanks

  2. #2

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    You find alternatives - tie down to heavy rocks, trees, whatever is available.

    Freestanding or not, I don't ever set up a tent without securely attaching it to the ground.

  3. #3
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    I have a zPacks tent and I've had issues with ground being too hard a handful of times, most notably in the Sierra Nevada and once in the Grand Canyon. I found unable rocks on all occasions. If there are no rocks at all, then that would be a problem depending on the type of shelter. For my tent, I would have to find some way to secure it to the ground or it won't stand. It can't really be secured to a tree. Over 200+ nights in that tent, I had to use rocks maybe 20 times. Doing that is hard on the guy lines and I've replaced the guy lines a couple of times due to fraying.

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    Default Concern: non- free standing tent...

    The Sierras is the area I was thinking of too.

  5. #5
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    Get titanium stakes, either shephard's crook or nail type. I've actually split rock with them, like a piton.
    "Throw a loaf of bread and a pound of tea in an old sack and jump over the back fence." John Muir on expedition planning

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by garlic08 View Post
    Get titanium stakes, either shephard's crook or nail type. I've actually split rock with them, like a piton.
    Still -- how do you get those stakes into the rock-hard ground?

  7. #7
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    I found unable rocks on all occasions.”

    just noticed a bad typo in my reply. I meant to type:

    ”I found usable rocks on all occasions.”

    The typo might have implied the opposite.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by jefals View Post
    Still -- how do you get those stakes into the rock-hard ground?
    You mean that you donít carry a sledge hammer while hiking?

  9. #9
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    Default

    There's the Big Rock Little Rock method.

    https://youtu.be/SNA-QvgLqVw

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee View Post
    I found unable rocks on all occasions.”

    just noticed a bad typo in my reply. I meant to type:

    ”I found usable rocks on all occasions.”

    The typo might have implied the opposite.
    There were at least a couple places I camped on the trt where it was hard finding even 4 or 5 small rocks...

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpburdelljr View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jefals View Post
    Still -- how do you get those stakes into the rock-hard ground?
    You mean that you don’t carry a sledge hammer while hiking?
    Not lately ?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odd Man Out View Post
    There's the Big Rock Little Rock method.

    https://youtu.be/SNA-QvgLqVw
    Yes -- if there are big and little rocks, I can "function at that junction". ? I'm concerned when in areas where rocks are scarce.

    Did you guys, BTW, notice my comment about water? If lack of water is not an issue, you can use it to soften up the ground. Neat trick!

  13. #13
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    Cowboy camp.
    You wonít die.
    Cheers!
    Wayne

  14. #14

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    It's pretty rare to not find any means of fairly conveniently securing the pyramid shelters I use(ZPacks Hexamid Pocket Tarp or MLD Solomid XL) with something or other, but I sometimes use my Katabatic Bristlecone bivy for cowboy camping in the desert.
    1020379.jpg

    20220221_131200.jpg

    That's not much of a solution if it rains, though!

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    I prefer free-standing tents anytime.
    While I'm paying quite a price weight-wise, its so much easier to setup in various conditions.

    The one lesson I've learned so far is, that even a so-called free-standing tent needs some tieouts for tha apsides, and this should better be good ones that can withstand the forces of strong winds.
    Over time, I got used to use trecking poles (if I carry any) plus snowshoes or skiers to provide secure anchors in difficult situations.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Quote Originally Posted by jefals View Post
    Still -- how do you get those stakes into the rock-hard ground?
    Use another rock as a stone age hammer.

    Once I found a perfect hammer rock and passed it to my partner when I was done with it. I'd worn a groove into the rock, and I convinced him that it was a stone age tool previously used by an ancient culture.
    "Throw a loaf of bread and a pound of tea in an old sack and jump over the back fence." John Muir on expedition planning

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    Quote Originally Posted by Venchka View Post
    Cowboy camp.
    You won’t die.
    Cheers!
    Wayne
    Well, you might die. If your down sleeping bag gets drenched ...could be big trouble.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by OwenM View Post
    It's pretty rare to not find any means of fairly conveniently securing the pyramid shelters I use(ZPacks Hexamid Pocket Tarp or MLD Solomid XL) with something or other, but I sometimes use my Katabatic Bristlecone bivy for cowboy camping in the desert.
    1020379.jpg

    20220221_131200.jpg

    T's not much of a solution if it rains, though!
    I got a bivy/tarp setup and tried it out in the backyard. It might be ok for a couple days, but I wouldn't want it for anything more than a day or two....

  19. #19
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    So if it's that much of a concern get a free-standing tent. Not trying to be a wise guy, just seems like the thing to do. Lots of lightweight options, particularly if you use trekking poles. TarpTent has several options that will keep you under 2 1/2 pounds, there must be others. I have a Rainbow, it can be set up totally freestanding with 2 trekking poles. I only use one pole, but even then I have lots of options.

  20. #20
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    I've been concerned about this also for the parts of the AT where there are wooden tent pads instead of dirt tent sites. Does tying the tent down with rocks work fairly well there?

    Aside: Once, in PA, I was unable to find any usable rocks for staking near my tent. I walked back out to the trail and immediately had my choice of several good ones.
    It's all good in the woods.

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