Not a Good day for a walk in the woods

[rdljr]

Another person created a day day for Search and Rescue. Think ahead people and ensure you don't put others at risk. It is just a walk in the woods until it is not.
Condolences to the family.

https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https...__tn__=-UK-R&c[0]=AT3_M76bAcAhDHBrCMCEy1ocrOgt3JXQqQNrEIc7YoNdPuhWv gff6ayvJB9WNiwuYKEL4g77dHcJ9NuAjyTpTBPwS6feOPa6idv us7q-B-K-98Px5eXZd77He6lwX1MDnQRyd5HBVU42ImYVssAiNrGz5c2UyA

[peakbagger]

For those Non Facebook folks, A hiker died on the AT Christmas day while doing the popular Franconia Ridge Loop Christmas Eve https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/...re-found-dead/

There was a major weather event Thursday into Friday all over New England. Winds gusts were recorded at 96MPH down in Franconia Notch at one point. Trees and power lines down all over for much of the weekend. It was a rain and then icing event so the trail up to the ridge must have been loaded with blowdowns, running water and ice flows with dropping temps. Not a good day for an underequipped inexperienced hiker to go hiking on a totally exposed ridgeline. Its surprising they could find volunteers to do the rescue as most folks were probably just trying to recover from the wild weather (many homes in NH were without power well into Christmas day.

Just a couple of weeks after another unprepared hiker died in the same area in unexpected weather conditions.

[ldsailor]

Apparently, the Facebook post has either been made private or removed. Whatever the case, I couldn't access it. I did access the CBS report. Wow! Didn't a big front just go through that area. I don't know what the weather was like yesterday, but it's below freezing today with an even lower wind chill. Why would an inexperienced hiker try to hike in that weather? It almost seems like the guy had a death wish. I feel sorry for his family and friends back in China.

[gpburdelljr]

“Why would an inexperienced hiker try to hike in that weather?”

Because he was inexperienced.

[Slo-go'en]

This was a pretty deadly year in the Whites. Will likely be a few more before the winter season is over.

[JNI64]

For those Non Facebook folks, A hiker died on the AT Christmas day while doing the popular Franconia Ridge Loop Christmas Eve https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/...re-found-dead/

There was a major weather event Thursday into Friday all over New England. Winds gusts were recorded at 96MPH down in Franconia Notch at one point. Trees and power lines down all over for much of the weekend. It was a rain and then icing event so the trail up to the ridge must have been loaded with blowdowns, running water and ice flows with dropping temps. Not a good day for an underequipped inexperienced hiker to go hiking on a totally exposed ridgeline. Its surprising they could find volunteers to do the rescue as most folks were probably just trying to recover from the wild weather (many homes in NH were without power well into Christmas day.

Just a couple of weeks after another unprepared hiker died in the same area in unexpected weather conditions.

Thanks I'm not a Facebook folk. So if these were the conditions Thursday and Friday and he still went up there Saturday, really?
Isn't there a local radio stations giving conditions in the mountains above tree line and such?

[peakbagger]

The local radio stations really have no news department and at best the weather forecast is prerecorded generic version specific to conditions at the base of the mountain. Most of the TV stations are south of the whites, are near the coast and not very useful for conditions 4000 feet higher at the junction of three major weather tracks. There is current minimally or no snow on the ground south of the whites due to that weather event (quite warm and 1 to 3" of rain). There is on the other hand, a year round weather observatory on the top of nearby Mt Washington(about 1000 feet higher) puts out forecasts in advance https://www.mountwashington.org/expe...-forecast.aspx which are readily available online so the information is out there. NH Fish and Game has a sign that every hiker passes just in from the trailhead that says in effect do not go unless properly equipped. There is also a prominent sign that the AMC Greenleaf shelter is closed for the season.

Reportedly the hiker was doing the loop clockwise and the body was found well down the ridge between Lincoln and Haystack, the same route that the hiker who died a few weeks back took (but did not make it as far). The local terrain to the west side of Franconia Notch blocks westerly winds somewhat until the final climb up the summit cone. Once above treeline, the path circles around the summit cone and fairly quickly is exposed to full westerly and northwesterly winds unimpeded by the lower mountains to the west of the notch. From that point to end of the ridge portion of the loop, it has full exposure with little or no cover. Its likely that someone thinking clearly would turn around (I have done so a couple of times in conditions somewhat less extreme in the winter) but the other factor is hypothermia. One of the earlier symptoms of hypothermia is the loss of clear thinking. This can happen with groups but when solo it can be deadly.

With respect to the forecasts,another issue that the press is reluctant to discuss is that there are multiple ski resorts in the area (including within sight of the summit at Cannon Mountain) The ski and snowmobile business is big in the state (the state gets cut from a room and meals tax), putting out extreme forecasts for winter conditions on summits might scare off guests so the commercial weather forecasts are very careful to underplay conditions or use terms carefully that a inexperienced person from outside the area may not pick up on. Skiers at ski resorts rarely get hypothermia as they are not out long enough for their core temps to drop and there are ski patrols to keep an eye out. With the exception of other hikers, there is no "hike patrol" so a person is effectively on their own from when they get out of their car until they get back in it. Its a 7 to 10 hour loop for many and my speculation it was slow going due to the prior high winds and rain.

BTW the forecast looks nice later in the week and no doubt hikers will be doing the loop despite the recent fatalities after checking the observatory forecast before heading out). On a nice winter day, with the right gear and experience, it is an entirely doable hike and hard to beat. Lots of social media lists it as "must do" hike and inevitably the accompanying photos are taken on a perfect day.

[JNI64]

Thank you for that very insightful explanation peakbagger.
To bad there's not at least 1 weather station on the radio 24 hours a day for the peaks and ubove tree lines. But that probably wouldn't help either like you say we're responsible for our own actions. It's kinda like a inexperienced fighter fighting a young Mike Tyson with no rules.

This latest hiker went the same way as the Last hiker that perished at apparently a junction that is a little confusing I've read? Is there a good trail sign at this location? Or were they just trying to take a short cut and just didn't know they were not on the same trail ?

[peakbagger]

There is question on the prior hikers point of getting turned around. Initially I thought she made it higher and got turned off the trail in a terrain "trap" that got her down into the headwaters of Lafayette Brook (a slide ravine). The rescuers found her body in the woods off of Greenleaf trail (down lower in the Lafayette Brook headwaters.) When found there was good evidence of hypothermia as they followed a line of discarded clothes (a known hypothermia symptom) The recent fatality was farther down the ridge having already summited Lafayette, and Lincoln. There really is no way to get lost on the ridge as the trail is the top of a steep ridge. There are sections of rough terrain that the trail winds around rather than going over so perhaps the hiker missed the bypass but in most cases the wrong path dead ends. The trail is screed in with rocks where possible but there are sections of open ledge where its not possible. Odds are if someone was out on the ridge in the weather conditions on Saturday they would have not been thinking clearly. The drainages that drop off the ridge are rocks slides with slabs at the base, no one thinking with a right mind would confuse them as a short cut.

[LoneStranger]

Thank you for that very insightful explanation peakbagger.
To bad there's not at least 1 weather station on the radio 24 hours a day for the peaks and ubove tree lines. But that probably wouldn't help either like you say we're responsible for our own actions. It's kinda like a inexperienced fighter fighting a young Mike Tyson with no rules.

This latest hiker went the same way as the Last hiker that perished at apparently a junction that is a little confusing I've read? Is there a good trail sign at this location? Or were they just trying to take a short cut and just didn't know they were not on the same trail ?

The high elevation weather forecast is readily available via several web sites. As pb pointed out, that does no good unless you know that you need to know. Relying on the local low elevation forecast is a good way to get into trouble in the Whites.

[JNI64]

For anyone interested Doug Shoe Bushcraft on YouTube is having a discussion on his channel tonight 12/29/22 about the 3 hikers that have died in the last month in the white mountains.

[JNI64]

Well excuse me I'm on vacation, tomorrow night 12-29-22 @9:00 pm.

[ldsailor]

“Why would an inexperienced hiker try to hike in that weather?”

Because he was inexperienced.

Come on - be serious. Someone lost a life here. Inexperienced people go hiking all the time. I was inexperienced when I started hiking. I spent a great deal of time researching and in that time learned much of what to do and not do. Nevertheless, my first hike was tagging along with an experienced hiker. Even today, there is a poster on this forum looking for others with whom to hike. Understanding what motivates a young girl to go trail running in dangerous conditions as happened a few weeks ago and why the subject of this forum thread went out unprepared may save lives in the future. Did he have access to adequate weather reports? Was he aware of the terrain in the current weather conditions? There are many unanswered questions. What could be changed to not have things like this happen as often as they do? While we could just say, "tough luck for the unprepared and inexperienced hiker" what about the SARS people who risk their lives when rescuing these inexperienced hikers?

I'm sure those in positions of responsibility ask these questions or at least should be. The answers may prevent the next death. Posing a question asking, "what happened" could save a life when someone reads it and the answer on a forum like this.

[gpburdelljr]

Come on - be serious. Someone lost a life here. Inexperienced people go hiking all the time. I was inexperienced when I started hiking. I spent a great deal of time researching and in that time learned much of what to do and not do. Nevertheless, my first hike was tagging along with an experienced hiker. Even today, there is a poster on this forum looking for others with whom to hike. Understanding what motivates a young girl to go trail running in dangerous conditions as happened a few weeks ago and why the subject of this forum thread went out unprepared may save lives in the future. Did he have access to adequate weather reports? Was he aware of the terrain in the current weather conditions? There are many unanswered questions. What could be changed to not have things like this happen as often as they do? While we could just say, "tough luck for the unprepared and inexperienced hiker" what about the SARS people who risk their lives when rescuing these inexperienced hikers?

I'm sure those in positions of responsibility ask these questions or at least should be. The answers may prevent the next death. Posing a question asking, "what happened" could save a life when someone reads it and the answer on a forum like this.

I was being serious when asked “Why would an inexperienced hiker try to hike in that weather?”, and I answered “Because he was inexperienced.” I’m sorry the guy lost his life, and wasn’t being critical of his inexperience, but had nothing to add that hadn’t already been said about how to educate the inexperienced about the dangers.

The following new article, dated 11/17/22, states that over 100 signs have been posted at White Mountain trailheads warning of the dangers, and include a phone number for current weather conditions.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/11/...on-trailheads/

[Daybreak]

I'm sure those in positions of responsibility ask these questions or at least should be.

Being serious, the people responsible are each of those individuals. We live in a country where we pride ourselves on our individual rights. NH's motto is live free or die. Winter related deaths such as these are common especially when you include skiing and snowmobiling deaths. In fact ski area and skateboarding parks exist only because the state laws which reflect the public interest severely limits their liability. Cross country skiing, snow-shoeing, peak bagging and ice climbing are also popular in the northeast. If you include all the deaths and serious injuries from winter driving and other activities the numbers may skyrocket.


Those responsible you refer to are few in number with little real responsibility or money. These $$$ are spread over many higher priority things. Sadly, trailhead registration, permits, instant internet expertise, GPS, cell phones, SPOT type devices, smart phones and now rescue insurance makes people more comfortable and sends them on the trails without the skills to places they shouldn't be.

[ldsailor]

Being serious, the people responsible are each of those individuals. We live in a country where we pride ourselves on our individual rights. NH's motto is live free or die. Winter related deaths such as these are common especially when you include skiing and snowmobiling deaths. In fact ski area and skateboarding parks exist only because the state laws which reflect the public interest severely limits their liability. Cross country skiing, snow-shoeing, peak bagging and ice climbing are also popular in the northeast. If you include all the deaths and serious injuries from winter driving and other activities the numbers may skyrocket.


Those responsible you refer to are few in number with little real responsibility or money. These $$$ are spread over many higher priority things. Sadly, trailhead registration, permits, instant internet expertise, GPS, cell phones, SPOT type devices, smart phones and now rescue insurance makes people more comfortable and sends them on the trails without the skills to places they shouldn't be.

At least your post identifies the problem more clearly. I could not read the whole Boston Globe article without a subscription, but the headline is pretty clear. It would seem steps have been taken to warn hikers as much as possible of the potential hazards of hiking especially in the winter. And the possible reason they ignore warnings are GPS, cell phones, etc. It's still unnerving to know people ignore logic when assessing their environment and die for that fault. Maybe a version of what you wrote should be put on those trailhead signs, "Rescue insurance and your electronic devices won't save your life if your experience level doesn't match the hiking environment."