Numbers don't match

**Fly By Mike** · 10-26-2006, 13:58

On the AT Conservancy website under "2,000 Milers - Facts and Statistics" they say that as of Oct 12, 2006 there were 174 NOBO's made it to Katahdin. That doesn't in any way match the number at the Ranger Station at Katahdin Stream. When I talked to the Ranger at the end of the first week in October, he told me the number that day had reached the high 400's. Do they count differently?

**Footslogger** · 10-26-2006, 14:01

Originally Posted by Fly By Mike

On the AT Conservancy website under "2,000 Milers - Facts and Statistics" they say that as of Oct 12, 2006 there were 174 NOBO's made it to Katahdin. That doesn't in any way match the number at the Ranger Station at Katahdin Stream. When I talked to the Ranger at the end of the first week in October, he told me the number that day had reached the high 400's. Do they count differently?

===================================

Maybe some of the hikers who signed in with the Ranger at Kathdin Stream did not come all the way from Springer ??

That does seem like quite a descrepancy though ...

'Slogger

**the goat** · 10-26-2006, 14:03

a lot of people don't report their hikes to the atc.

**Thor** · 10-26-2006, 14:24

Originally Posted by Fly By Mike

On the AT Conservancy website under "2,000 Milers - Facts and Statistics" they say that as of Oct 12, 2006 there were 174 NOBO's made it to Katahdin. That doesn't in any way match the number at the Ranger Station at Katahdin Stream. When I talked to the Ranger at the end of the first week in October, he told me the number that day had reached the high 400's. Do they count differently?

My understanding is that the number at Katahdin Stream is the number of people who have hiked in from Monson through the Hundred Miles. I could be wrong, however.

The ATC number is most likely based on how many 2000 Miler 'rocker' applications they have received. I imagine that a lot of people who finish don't care enough to send one in, and just as many either proscrastinate or forget to send it in altogether. Either way, I'd say the truth lies somewhere in the middle. It's not like either location has a reliable way to determine how many people have passed them without reporting, or who may just be lying about where they came from/how far they walked.

All I know is that the day I summited, October 6th, there were 19 Thru-Hikers up there. Possibly more.

**Jack Tarlin** · 10-26-2006, 15:14

Slogger's comment above is right on the mark.

**Frolicking Dinosaurs** · 10-26-2006, 15:58

As Thor and the goat note, many do not report their hike to the ATC. I agree with Thor's assessment that the truth likely is between 174 and the high 400's - my guess would be around 350.

**Pokey2006** · 10-26-2006, 16:12

Could be some people still need to go back and finish a section before applying for the 2000-miler status. An awful lot of hikers skipped a piece of trail and moved on ahead so they could do the 100-mile wilderness and Katahdin. At least they're being honest and not applying for the certificate until they finish the WHOLE trail.

**Fly By Mike** · 10-26-2006, 16:26

Yes, it seems like towards the end of the season there were quite a few who moved ahead to get Katahdin done and had to go back and fill in some sections. Also I'm wondering if the Ranger's figure includes section hikers. I'll ask him next time I'm out there. I'll also ask if he knows who was the last to summit for the year and on what date. Even though the park closes for camping on Oct 15th its possible to hike to the summit into November in some years depending on snowfal and ice accumulation above treeline. A good pair of gloves and boots that grip are needed though. Even today it doesn't look like there has been any significant snow up there yet.

**mweinstone** · 10-26-2006, 17:44

i have somthing to offer. as a teenager, i used to tell thru hikers i was thruhiking . so did my friends. it was too irresistable to wanna be one. who among us did this? and arent the numbers reflecting more of the same ? still going on. on the north side of the trail. is it so hard to belive? people envy us hikers. its what brings in new blood.

**mweinstone** · 10-26-2006, 17:45

174 made it. the rest lied.

**Pokey2006** · 10-26-2006, 17:50

You could call them liars if the numbers were reversed -- if the ATC had the higher number of people saying they thru-hiked and at Katahdin there were fewer people who actually did hike into the park.

How could they have lied to the rangers at Katahdin about not being there if they were, in fact, there?

**Pokey2006** · 10-26-2006, 17:52

And it would be hard to lie to other thrus going through Maine. By then, everyone pretty much knows everyone else out there.

**mweinstone** · 10-26-2006, 18:21

nobody knows those extra names. and they only have to pass hikers at the end and claim they were behind the whole time. or that they flipped. the number who dont sign in at springer, harpers and katadhin is smaller than the descepency.

**Pokey2006** · 10-26-2006, 18:36

Actually, I think all the numbers are screwed up. The numbers from Springer were too low, I thought. And the numbers at Harpers Ferry were too high, including a lot of hikers who were yellow or aqua-blazing.

The numbers from Katahdin are probably accurate for counting all thru-hikers who got to Maine, but perhaps didn't hike every single mile of the trail. The numbers from ATC are probably accurate for counting those who claim they DID hike every single mile of the trail.

**TJ aka Teej** · 10-26-2006, 19:24

The Katahdin Stream numbers are for finishing northbound thruhikers, not flippers, not 100 Mile section hikers. On Oct 15th Blue and Miyagi were given numbers 486 & 487. (Miyagi told me he was #586 at HF) A KSC Ranger once told me only about 2/3s of the finishing nobos take the ATC form when it is offered to them. The ATC gets all the data recorded by Baxter Park on all the sorts of AT hikers, but I don't know what they do with it.

The ATC numbers, as noted, are just for those reporting to them as becoming 2000 Milers this year.

In my opinion, the best records are those kept by Steve the Ferryman at the Kennebec crossing in Caratunk. He's been posting excellent end of the season stats at www.riversandtrails.com

**Pokey2006** · 10-26-2006, 19:30

I'm not seeing any numbers on there...I would think the Katahdin Stream numbers would be similar to what he has, though.

I am curious as to what the final count will be.

**Fly By Mike** · 10-26-2006, 21:51

Me too, Pokey. If I can find Ridge Runner Dave I'll bet he knows just about every 06 thru that came by Abol. Wonder if he kept count.

**weary** · 10-26-2006, 22:36

Originally Posted by Pokey2006

You could call them liars if the numbers were reversed -- if the ATC had the higher number of people saying they thru-hiked and at Katahdin there were fewer people who actually did hike into the park.

How could they have lied to the rangers at Katahdin about not being there if they were, in fact, there?

I never registered because I wandered around a lot in the south and didn't complete "every mile" as the ATC application mentions. I've gone back and filled in many of the gaps, but a 2000-miler patch no longer strikes me as a useful goal.

Weary

**cling_on** · 10-27-2006, 02:05

Yeah, we were counted in the Katahdin Stream numbers, without even being asked if we'd done the whole trail. The ATC wouldn't have our names, though, since we took that chairlift up Wildcat Mtn. and don't qualify for 2000 miler status! And people, it was SO WORTH IT.

**Pokey2006** · 10-27-2006, 02:30

Who needs 2000-miler status if YOU are happy with the decisions you made.

I personally think there should be two certificates. One for the blue-blazers, who deserve recognition even if they didn't hike every single foot of the trail, and one for the purist, who deserves even more recognition for doing just that. It would, at least, clear up the discrepencies in the numbers.

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