AT Thru-Hike with only 3 to 5 resupplies?

[fiddlehead]

After Brian Robinson and Squeaky, I don't see how Lone Wolf says it CAN'T be done. It probably won't be done. But sure it CAN.
Thousands of Runners run 100 miles a day on potatoes, and drinks and soup. These foods can be lightweight. Throw in a fishing rod and a wildcrafter in springtime with edible plants abundant. No need to carry water or fuel on the AT (using a zip stove or hobo stove) and packweight comes way down.
I've seen Hindu pilgrims in Nepal going a 1000 miles with nothing but a shawl. sure they had handouts but i've also seen some excellent yogis on the AT. Bring in a dog or two as pets which can be eaten and a few other things your imagination can surely come up with and it isn't so hard. (is dumpster diving allowed?) There's no hurry anyway.
The only real hurdle i see is the person. Who would want to? probably not anyone i know. But make it a worthwhile challenge (say a million dollars or a "never have to work again" reward, and you'll have lots of people trying.

[Blissful]

It can't be done. It won't be done. The first 2 maybe.

L. Wolf at 6,000 plus posts...there's something that was (ahem) done! whoowee. Talk about mind over matter. ha ha

Besides that...

Honestly I don't know how a blind man could hike the trail.

I don't know how I'll do it.

But I like the saying - where there's a will, there's a way.

And the idea this man who has conquered throat cancer, can only take liquids and now wants to do the trail - wow, go for it! And I really hope you make it all the way.

[SGT Rock]

I consider the famous low pack weight advertised for Ray Jardine to be something of a fraud. When someone first told me some guy thru-hiked the AT carrying a pack weighing only whatever his weighed, I objected that this wouldn’t be possible. Then the story-teller realized Jardine’s weight didn’t include his food.

I bought the Jardine book.

The hiker who related the amazing Jardine pack weight had also ignored the second Jardine, his wife; they split and shared equipment. Had each been self sufficient, as if each was a solo hiker, their average pack weight would have increased substantially.

I compared my and their equipment and pack weights. I was quite thrilled how closely the weight of my equipment list compared with the “Jardine combined list.” My thrill faded quickly, with the realization there was little new information I could use to reduce my pack weight significantly.

If you wish to test my assertion, inventory and weigh your equipment. Compare your inventory with the list given for either Jardine. Add the weight of everything you’d need which was only carried by the other Jardine.

Yes his packing list and his book does have holes in it. He recommends carrying rain gear in addition to an umbrella for windy conditions, but then doesn't have any on his list. He also has a water purification system but doesn't recommend using one. He also says he has a stove but never discusses it - just how to cook with a fire. He also says the best foods for nutrition are raw, but then he also says he tried hiking with a raw food diet and it didn't work. There are more examples of that sort of inconsistency. But the combined equipment list really isn't as big a deal as you make it out to be. He carries the large tarp and quilt for two people. If he were to go solo he could carry smaller versions of both of those - then get the extra stuff he needs from Jenny's pack to get him ready for his solo hike. Her pack weight is lower than his. Also add to that his gear list was made a few years ago and some of his stuff was made with older materials - his tarp is a lot heavier then, than it would be now if he made it with sil-nylon.

But besides that, a lot of people hike sub 8 these days. I did a hike with a sub 5 pound once - and did fine. But I wasn't at my level of comfort and wouldn't stay that way. Right now my base for this sort of hiking is slightly under 10 - but my pack could also handle the loads of food at that weight. But the point of this thread was not to play packing list one-up games, it was about re-supply/mileage strategy.

Not surprisingly I prefer my list. I’m unwilling to make some of the compromises they accept. I’m not close to the ounce weenies they are.

Aren't we all. No two packing lists are ever alike.

My point is, don’t just add the advertised Jardine pack weight to the mix, when considering an AT “Death March.” Come to terms with, and weigh, what YOU will actually NEED to do this.

Again - the point of my posts were not to come up with a packing list of what to carry, it was to illustrate that you could still have a normal pack weight and have gear that would get you through a thru-hike. Using the RJ sub 8 pack as a comment that the gear was possible was never meant to be an endorsement of RJ or to be the purpose of the discussion. The purpose was the re-supply/mileage strategy.

You also need to factor in, as your nutritional deficit increases, your perseverance will diminish.

That is why in an earlier post I said this hiker would probably want to spend two weeks at each re-supply point eating before they moved on.

[Doctari]

I say "do it with NO re-supplies"

How? you ask. Simple: 5 ~ 80 Lb packs = 400 Lbs. Subtract 5 Lbs per pack for pack wt, and 20 Lbs for "Other" stuff, still allows you 355 Lbs for food.

Start by carring pack #1 up the trail 1 to 2 miles. Walk back to start, carry pack #2 to Pack #1's location. Repete till all packs are together again. Miles hiked for the day @ 2 MPT = 18. AT miles covered = 2. Doing so would make you the first absolutly pure AT thru hiker, you would never have to leave the trail, for anything. Only get water when you cross a stream, set up camp ON the trail.

Just think of the bragging rights!

Of course, it would likely take about 1090 days to do a thru, so that means more food needed, so, lets say 2 more packs, so 4 more round trips (at least at the start) so longer to hike so more food so longer to hike so, , , , , , ,


Nevermind!

[Mouse]

Welll, one could always try the method Amundson employed getting to the South Pole but with fellow hikers instead of dogs. That would eliminate any need for resupply!

[tarbender]

Baltimore Jack has been many times heard saying the following, "Kill the wounded, eat the dead, and divide the gear!" One could easily thru hike without a resupply. There are plenty of wounded along the way. I have given up all hope of any further serious comment emerging from this thread.

[Biloxi]

boston..well things took a turn for the worse...and also I am expecting my 1st grandbaby..so its off till proubly 08 sometime ..have to see if things swing back in my favor..but I am still planning

[halftime]

andrew skurka had it figured where he could go between 700 - 800 miles on 1st leg starting with a 65-70 lb pack..I dont think he intended to go the entire way but to see how far and how fast with no resupply..so it is feasible that someone can and will do it in 3-5 stops..

Ryan Jordon has done similar research on going 500-600 unsupported miles across the arctic tundra.
http://www.ryanjordan.com/2006_arcti...d_and_coo.html

[Biloxi]

well demetri coupounas hiked the 482 mile colorado trail without resupply..and in july roman dial went 600 miles of alaskan widerness without..and for andrew skukas projections he figured 55lbs food and 15lbs for other gear for a total of 70lbs and his projections were a low of 709 miles and a high of 872 miles ..so realisticly it could be done with only 2 resupplies dont get me wrong it would take a special, very disiplined, stong hiker...such as skurka to do it ..but yes it can be done

[halftime]

http://www.ryanjordan.com/2006_arctic/

Arctic Traverse Completed - 1000 km - No Resupply

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

Arctic 1000 Expedition Completes First Unsupported* Traverse of America's Largest and Most Remote Contiguous Wilderness, Visits America's Remotest Spot En Route

Bozeman, Mont. (July 11, 2006) - On July 4, a team of long distance trekkers completed the first and longest ever unsupported* trekking traverse of America's most remote, roadless, uninhabited wilderness, a distance of 1000 km (600 mi) across Alaska's western Arctic region from the Chukchi Sea to the Alaskan Pipeline.

En route, in addition to completing America's longest wilderness traverse, the party became the first to visit the most remote location in the U.S. by fair means - carrying all of their gear, food, and supplies for the entirety of the trek in their backpacks and traveling entirely on foot.

[Mags]

Seems logical to me. Can also see how the sport of long distance hiking could benifit in the long run.

Ah...but that's the crux of this whole discussion: Is LD hiking a sport? For most people..no.

For people who want to hike w/o a resupply, yes.

Different strokes for different folks. But, it is now getting to the point where I swear people are making up "firsts" just to get a blurb in a magazine.

First AT thru-hike w/o a resupply on a pogo stick..all using XYZ Gear!

I think that is the real reason for alll these new "records". To sell schwag.

(Mind you, I am not talking about speed records....but the newly created "records" that seem to come out of nowhere...)

[halftime]

Ah...but that's the crux of this whole discussion: Is LD hiking a sport? For most people..no.

MagsThanks for sharing your perspective on this. I actually hesitated to use the term sport. Curious how you would define it. As an Art? Philosophy? Or just let it stand on its own term?My point was (regardless of the motivation behind something like this) there would likely be some advancements in technology or new inovation that would be of universal benifit. Better Food and Nutrition might be one.BTW: Congrats on completing your CDT journey. I enjoyed viewing the photos.</p>

[ed bell]

MagsThanks for sharing your perspective on this. I actually hesitated to use the term sport. Curious how you would define it. As an Art? Philosophy? Or just let it stand on its own term?

Sounds like an interesting thread topic/poll. Hobby, pastime, and way of life all come to mind. Sport, not so much. I'm sure some would beg to differ.

[The Solemates]

I think it can be done.

Gardenville laid out a schedule in post #13 that averages a little over 20 days per resupply, while hiking about 20 miles per day. At 1.5 pounds of food per day, which is easily attainable in my opinion, food would weigh in at around 30lbs. If you use lightweight gear, a pack weight of 40-45 lbs is attainable. Doing 20-mile days with 40-45 pounds is not incomprehensible, especially if you hike in the summer and your diet is supplemented with town food at every opportunity.

It's not as hard as it sounds. But then again, why?

[Biloxi]

that would be something to watch..what a thread...how about MS on a pogo stick thread doin a yo-yo with mweinstoned and lone wolf as support...just kidding

[Sly]

I think it's nuts, and can't see walking within spitting distance of a PO, store or hostel carrying 2 lbs of food much less 40 lbs.

YMMV

[halftime]

halftime,

I have been making my own External Frame's and Pack Bags for some time now. I am working on a new External Frame and Bag system for my AT hike in 2007. The current frame version, made for what I consider a heavy load, weighs 22 ounces. It would be nice to see a New Technology "Lighter External Frame" and Bag system made by one of the big commercial pack makers. I talked to Jansport about a lighter external frame but was told not anytime soon.

Gardenville: Was browsing through the pictures gallery and stumbled onto photos of your external pack systems. Quite impressive. Best of luck with your 07 hike.

[Squeaky 2]

this is very interesting!!!! one of my many thoughts and mad ideas i came up with in 2005 ( i had alot of time to think!!) was to hike the whole trail with out resupply. to do the entire trail with what you start out with on your back. with ultralight gear it would be possible. but you would have to factor in a heavy duty pack to deal with the heavy early loads. before people jump on my back and say that cant be done bear in mind that my training over here for the sub forty consists of a 65lb which i hike with at 5mph on the river tow paths and well over 4 mph cross country with a 50lb+ pack. running the up hills. one day was 45 miles in under 10 hours.
not to mention mountain sherpas who carry 180lb loads?!!!

maybe it could be worth cosidering after the flack of doing a supported sub 40!

[rickb]

I think I would have to park myself along the Trail somewhere to watch you hike on by.

I promise that I woluld resit the temptaion to hold out a candybar in my outstretched hand

Whatever you elect to do on your next adventure I am sure it will be something cool.

I hope its on the AT!

Rick B

[ed bell]

this is very interesting!!!! one of my many thoughts and mad ideas i came up with in 2005 ( i had alot of time to think!!) was to hike the whole trail with out resupply. to do the entire trail with what you start out with on your back. with ultralight gear it would be possible. but you would have to factor in a heavy duty pack to deal with the heavy early loads. before people jump on my back and say that cant be done bear in mind that my training over here for the sub forty consists of a 65lb which i hike with at 5mph on the river tow paths and well over 4 mph cross country with a 50lb+ pack. running the up hills. one day was 45 miles in under 10 hours.
not to mention mountain sherpas who carry 180lb loads?!!!

maybe it could be worth cosidering after the flack of doing a supported sub 40!

Best of luck to you! That is some hard-core training, no doubt. Hope to be hearing of any plans soon.