Some noob tarp questions

[Fenrir]

The SO and I are planing a thru for 08! She finally agreed (as long as she can find a place for the dog!) so I think that deserves a banana and we looked at gear and she thinks (as do I) that a tarp would be the way to go, so heres another banana . BUT she is unsure, her primary concerns being bugs and privacy and she'd like to try it first.. I've seen some bug netting bivys and netting sewn in and the like, but for me I'd like something that I can take out or put in at my leisure, anyone have a system like this? Preferably DIY? And any ideas for privacy? Beaks large enough to go to the ground when necessary? If I decide on beaks/vestbules/whatevers do I have to have a tarp designed for them or can any sufficiently large tarp do it? And finally the current issue is she wants to try it first, what is the cheapest/best way to sample tarp camping? I don't really want to spend a lot of money if we don't end up settling that way. If it helps we'd do inital testing in the desert, so no rain . Sorry for all the noob questions, but I've done some searches and can't find anything really specific to my qyestions. Any help would be appreciated!

[dla]

Get a cheap 10'x10' tarp. Read Ray Jardine's site on pitching an A-frame. Set it up in your backyard. Turn on the sprinkler and lay underneath. See what you think.

[Fenrir]

OK, do you recomened a certain type thats 10x10? Thanks for the help!

[Dances with Mice]

It's not DIY and it's relatively pricey, but check out the Black Diamond MegaLight. It has an optional floor & bug net option. It also meets the privacy needs.

[aaroniguana]

Agree with dla. For two a 10x10 is perfect. You can pitch it low in high wind, you can pitch it high in the sun, you can set the edges up for extra cross-ventilation.

Boundary Waters has one for $100, Campmor has it for $39.99. There's your range. Let go of the name brand.

[TIGGER]

Hi,
This is TIGGER of Tigger's Tree House in ETNA NH. ) Please see 2007 Thru hiker's handbook).
First, I am SO GLAD you and your S.O. are going for the Trail.
Re your Tarp and Bug questions, I would refer you to two web sites.

1) Before ANYONE tackles any big hike, they ALL should see this Video.
www.lwgear.com " Backpacking Secrets Revealed".

2) Re your Tarp, The biggest SIL TARP you can get is still VERY LIGHT WEIGHT!! and compresses into a small little tiny bag!!! www.integraldesigns.com
3) A VERY GOOD Bug tent also at Integral Designs.com

4) PLEASE!!!!!! THINK AND RETHINK EVERY PIECE OF GEAR YOU TAKE.
You do not need mittens as you will have an extra pain of sox.ETC,,,

5) A head lamp and another squeeze flashlight is better than..........
( YOU WILL NOT BELIEVE THIS......... a LARGE, TWO "D" BATTERY Flashlight I saw someone with a pack four feet long with..........
6) I personally sleep in a BYER's hammock with a bug net attached. I personally will never sleep on the ground again.. Even in the winter, ( am working on the insulation thing... cold here in NH.... and yes,,,, ther are parts of the trail without trees, You can make a lovely bugnet/tarptent with the hammock and hiking poles

So anyway I hope this helps...
7) Please always remember two things.......... ( well maybe four...)
A) The AT is not out to get you.
B) No matter who you told,, you DO NOT!!! Have to do the whole thing in one sitting....... It will be there for you and there are still MANY lovely and challenging long stretches for you to complete....
C) take care of your feet. ( Oven Turkey Roasting bags will hold hot water for you to pour in and massage/soak and wash your feet every night) ( Do it!)

D) And the most important thing..........
COME VISIT WITH US IN OUR HOME WHEN YOU GET TO HANOVER NH!!!
Tigger

[Fenrir]

Thanks for the advice guys! I'm not really attached to a brand name, I'm just looking for a guideline in price. I was reading SGT Rock's dirtbag post and he suggest a big blue tarp, are these any good to try out tarping? Thanks again!

[Fenrir]

Also, if not the blue nylon type, what about tyvek tarps? I've seen a Trailjournal or two where people had them, I've done some searches, but I'm still confused on what grade/type tyvek. Maybe I'm just better off with the blue?

[Frosty]

Thanks for the advice guys! I'm not really attached to a brand name, I'm just looking for a guideline in price. I was reading SGT Rock's dirtbag post and he suggest a big blue tarp, are these any good to try out tarping? Thanks again!

Look at the weight of backpacking tarps. A lightweight, silnylon tarp does not cost that much more than a cheap plastic one.

The 10x10 $39 dollar tarp at Campmor weighs over two pounds and is stiff plastic. It is not only heavy, it does not fold small. IMO, this is not a good choice of a tarp to be carrying on the trail.

Campmor has two backpacking tarps, an 8x10 for $65 and weighs 13 ounces, and is big enough for two, and a 10x12 tarp which will be huge but will allow more options as in beak-type pitches. It weighs 19 ounces and costs $85 dollars. Both backpacking tarps are silnylon and pack very small.

If you are not sure if you are going to tarp it or not on the trail, then a cheap tarp is a great idea to find out. Buy one at KMart and go car camping with it. If your SO has problem with bugs, you will find out VERY quickly.

Personally I like a floorless tarptent. Have not had a problem with bugs getting past the netting.

If your SO is at all hesitant about camping in a tarp after a couple car camping trips, do yourself a favor and buy a tent. Hubba hubba or something. You may think it is expensive, but it is a lot cheaper than a shuttle to the airport from Neels Gap and airfare back home.

[aaroniguana]

My apologies. I missed that the $39 one at Campmor was not silnylon. It's coated taffeta which is MUCh heavier and bulkier.

[bigcranky]

I have owned all three Campmor sil-nylon tarps, the 5x8, the 8x10, and the 10x12. IIRC these are made by Equinox. They are basic but well-made tarps, and the price can't be beat. The only criticism I could point out is that the 8x10 tarp has the seam running in the "wrong" direction.

The 8x10 is large enough for two people, but it can't be battened down quite as well in rough weather. The 10x12 foot tarp is fantastic, and would make a great starter tarp for two. There is plenty of dry space underneath, even in bad weather, plus room for all your gear, and room to cook, and it's large enough for privacy.

With any tarp you'll need a ground sheet. This can be a piece of Tyvek or sil-nylon, or just some 2-mil plastic sheeting from the home depot store. You have several choices for bug protection. You could combine the ground sheet with netting walls and make sort of a mesh tent to go under your tarp. You could build a homemade mesh bivy, or buy one -- though if you sew, you can make a 2-person bivy for not much money. You could just wear a head net to bed -- the true ultralight solution, because it's multi-use (you can wear it during the day, too).

If you want to just throw money at it, you might check out one of the Tarptent shelters. These have the floor, the netting, etc., all put together for you.

[dla]

What I mean't was: get a $7 tarp from WhateverMart. Try pitching. Try sleeping under it. See what it is like with the sprinkler going.

A cheap blue tarp will let you know if tarping is right for you. If you like tarping then you can start the crazed search for a tarp.

REI had PU-coated nylon tarps on sale for $17. I bought a 9.75' x 7' which is big enough for two people who like each other. Weighs 22oz. A Silicone-Nylon version of that would weigh about 15oz.

[Mags]

You'll also want to check out Sgt. Rock's tarp setup page.

Best site I've seen for basic tarp setup.

FWIW, I've used the Campor 8x10 tarp in the past (PCT2002, other smaller jaunts) and I've been happy with it. A palace for one, a little snug for two. As has been suggested, the 10x12 may be a good investment for the little extra room.

The tarp is a great "bread and butter" piece of gear. Basic, no-frills, inexpensive, gets the job done quite well.

[iliketacos]

I agree with setting up the tarp in the back yard and running the sprinkler (don't forget to aim the sprinkler at a 45-degree angle to your tarp) but you also should do the following in my humble opinion:

Have some of the neighborhood kids come by and yank on the tarp tie downs and beat on the top of the tarp at random times throughout your stay, also get some fake snakes and bugs and put them around the edge of the tarp, also to not limit yourself to during your back yard experience, get fresh dirt and pave it at a 15-degree slope and water it before you lay on it under your tarp, also criss-cross some large sticks to simulate tree roots that you have to lay on and, while your at it-soak yourself and ALL your gear and your food to maximize your experience. Do all this at 5pm and stay under the tarp until 6am the next morning. Hopefully it's a very cold night. I'm sure I missed something to add here. Good luck.

[Frosty]

I'm sure I missed something to add here. Good luck.

You need to find a couple guys you know snore really loudly. At midnight have them show up and set up a tent 5 feet from your tarp setup. They should have large flashlights and swear a lot, and bump into your tarp a few times. When they finally settle in and you're just about to go to sleep, then they can snore all night. Except for when they get up to pee, which they will do in the five feet of space between their tent and your tarp.

[Fenrir]

Thanks for the heads up on the stuff I'll have to look out for, I'll be sure to keep it in mind before I make the final decision. dla, I see some polyester tarps on sale at REI, but I don't find anything about a polyurethane coating on them, am I looking at the wrong item? Thanks again

[dla]

I agree with setting up the tarp in the back yard and running the sprinkler (don't forget to aim the sprinkler at a 45-degree angle to your tarp) but you also should do the following in my humble opinion:

Have some of the neighborhood kids come by and yank on the tarp tie downs and beat on the top of the tarp at random times throughout your stay, also get some fake snakes and bugs and put them around the edge of the tarp, also to not limit yourself to during your back yard experience, get fresh dirt and pave it at a 15-degree slope and water it before you lay on it under your tarp, also criss-cross some large sticks to simulate tree roots that you have to lay on and, while your at it-soak yourself and ALL your gear and your food to maximize your experience. Do all this at 5pm and stay under the tarp until 6am the next morning. Hopefully it's a very cold night. I'm sure I missed something to add here. Good luck.

Nothing like a mouse running across your face in the middle of the night to maximize your tarping experience. Or deer, those gracefull mists of the night, tripping over your tie-outs. Or a bear sniffing your feet. Just teasing

Actually the only downside is if there are a lot of mosquitoes, or if your dog likes to get up and do a 360 every 5 minutes.

[Jim Adams]

i have tarped extensively and throughout both of my A.T. thru hikes. i am not fond of DEET but i do use it. forget the netting for the A.T. on both of my thrus, i used deet less than a handful of nights and had no other bug problems.
a 10 x 10 nylon tarp is a great start(campmor, ($39.95 ) and can be used for your thru hike however i would use it as much as possible to learn and then buy a lighter, more packable silnylon tarp for the hike. try to stay with square dimensions when first starting (8 x 8, 10 x 10, 12 x 12) as it is far easier to learn good set-up with a symetrical tarp.
tie off of every grommet or loop so as to guy the tarp tight, prevent "pooling" and flapping. a loose tarp will flap in the wind and tear itself or the grommet holes.
also be very aware of the slope of the land. a tarp will not keep you dry if all of the water running off of it runs back underneath and soaks you and your gear.
try to tie one corner high to a tree, pull the opposite corner into the wind and tie it at ground level then pull out the side corners and tie them at ground lever. tie off all other grommets pulling them tight. i survived hurricane hugo totally dry with this set-up.
they are GREAT shelters but don't make your first time use a camping trip...it takes some learning to work out all of the kinks.
geek

[MAD777]

Yikes! iliketacos and Frosty make me want to check into the Hilton!

As stated earlier, Black Diamond Mids, Tarptents are one step up from basic tarps and IMHO are excellent, lightweight shelters that sound like they meet your friend's criteria. Also, look at Golite Hex and MSR Twin Peaks.

http://www.golite.com/product/produc...x?p=SH6106&s=1

http://mountainsafetyresearch.com/tents/twinpeaks.asp

If you are slightly handy, you can DIY based on one of these suggestions as a model.

[Fenrir]

Thanks again for all the advice, I'll have to consider the pyramid stuff. I'm also curious about vestibules. Does the tarp has to be sewn/made a special way or will a large enough tarp be able to pitch with them?