Should the AT be moved?

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

You could flank hike the entire trail, get off about 100 yards on either side and start walking. In 2000 miles you wouldn't see another human except at road crossings. I FLANK-HIKED THE APPALACHIAN TRAIL!! Look good on the nylon resume, maybe even put you up there with the speed hikers.

You are one of the few people I know who would likely be capable of doing this.

.... Making any change risks a cascade of unforseen consequence. Probably best to make those changes incrementally, carefully and slowly.

Excellent observation - again, the sort of ideas I hoped would come forth.

If you move it you create a position that the next time it’s decided that any area is being over exposed that all you have to do is move it again. Once you start down this road, .....Better to focus on education of how to act in the environment then to take it away from people.

Question

What is it that makes this area in jeopardy, what are the eco reasons to move it in this section?

excellent observations again. Glad to see some thinking people are in this discussion.

[sasquatch2014]

I am going to thru starting this march. I would like to see Wyoming!

wtmntcaretaker its real easy as you come through PA take the yellow blaze trail to the west and saty on that for about 1700 miles.

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

AT-West in Wyoming... I like it

[wtmntcaretaker]

I think I will take the route to maine. maybe if I dont run out of money I will start south and head west.

[Cuffs]

I have no objection to multiple trails paralleling each other.

I take huge objection to urban growth encroaching on public lands. Im glad lands were put aside for public use, so they wont be developed, but how do you educate EVERYONE on its proper use? Unless you can do that, you will have people who abuse the lands (LNT stuff.) The 2 Wilderness areas here in AL probably have more use than any other Forests or state parks. You put the "wilderness" name on it and people think they are really roughing it even tho their car is only 100yards away. I see more mess left behind in the "wilderness" than any other areas, despite signage and other people trying to teach them...

To me, every area is a sensitive eco system. If you move the trail from one area to help that ecosystem, your re-route is just going to disturb another area. I dont see any given place on the trail as having more priority over another in terms of the ecosystem, its all a delicate balance. If you truly want to protect the ecosystem, you need to keep out the human entirely.

[Montego]

Well personally ...I'd like to see it moved a little closer to Wyoming !!

'Slogger

As a former resident of Rock Springs, I have to second that. Just bring plenty of sun screen.

Seriously, reading the posts on WB, it seems that the problems with the eco-sensitive areas and other damage has more to do with the vast amount of day hikers and photo happy tourists, than with the section hiker or thru-hikers who go by the creed of LNT.

Hmmm - just wondering if there would be a practical way of regulating the numbers of day hikers and tourists (Montego dons his flame-retardent suit).

[wtmntcaretaker]

the key is education. trying to bring bubba up to wilderness budda

[sasquatch2014]

As a former resident of Rock Springs, I have to second that. Just bring plenty of sun screen.

And people complain about the rocks in Pa and the Black flies in Me. Is there anything in Rock Springs that isn't rock that doesn't sting, stick or bite?

Now the Big Horns that is a good area. And if you even think of saying Jackson you should be sent to Evanston for an Evaluation.

[wtmntcaretaker]

and trying to fix my spelling.

[Tipi Walter]

I have no objection to multiple trails paralleling each other.

I take huge objection to urban growth encroaching on public lands. Im glad lands were put aside for public use, so they wont be developed, but how do you educate EVERYONE on its proper use? Unless you can do that, you will have people who abuse the lands (LNT stuff.) The 2 Wilderness areas here in AL probably have more use than any other Forests or state parks. You put the "wilderness" name on it and people think they are really roughing it even tho their car is only 100yards away. I see more mess left behind in the "wilderness" than any other areas, despite signage and other people trying to teach them...

To me, every area is a sensitive eco system. If you move the trail from one area to help that ecosystem, your re-route is just going to disturb another area. I dont see any given place on the trail as having more priority over another in terms of the ecosystem, its all a delicate balance. If you truly want to protect the ecosystem, you need to keep out the human entirely.

In your post there's the problem and the solution: "Their car is only 100 yards away". Closing road access is probably the biggest thing that can be done to protect an area. In the Slickrock wilderness(NC), there's a 6 mile road(Big Fat) that travels into the heart of the area, giving quick access to Slickrock Creek on a 1.5 mile trail. At the bottom of this trail there is more garbage than anywhere else in the wilderness. Why? Road access.

Ed Abbey was a proponent of closing road access to various areas. To me it sounds like a workable, solvable solution. People should have to earn the right to visit some places, earn the right by sweat and an element of risk. That's why wilderness areas do not have roads, even though they may be surrounded by roads. To give an extreme example, there's no road to the top of Mt Everest. To climb to the top involves risk and possible death. Isn't that what wilderness is all about?

But all this is moot as we grow to 450 million people by 2050, along with 300 million cars zipping into every nook and cranny. I pity the future backpackers . . .

[wtmntcaretaker]

I agree with that. in that case we shout shut down I-93, 302 and rt. 16

[wtmntcaretaker]

tee hee

[Frolicking Dinosaurs]

And I-40 at Davenport Gap....

I have witnessed what Tipi talks about with the 1.5 mile trail at Big Fat -- the area is trashed regularly because people don't want to carry their garbage back up the somewhat steep mile of the trail back to the parking lot. That said, when I was a weekend warrior I loved the Big Fat parking lot because I could be in the middle of the wilderness on Friday night

[Montego]

And people complain about the rocks in Pa and the Black flies in Me. Is there anything in Rock Springs that isn't rock that doesn't sting, stick or bite?

Now the Big Horns that is a good area. And if you even think of saying Jackson you should be sent to Evanston for an Evaluation.

The only thing that now BITES in Rock Springs, is that they changed the law to eliminate "go-cups" Ahhhhh - the memories...........................

[JAK]

I think the ideal situation would be that the AT be more than just a single corridor. It should be at least two trails in parallel with numerous interconnections, in other words, a WIDER coridor all the way from Georgia to Maine. There should also be green trails not just connecting you to other trails and trail towns, but going right through the nearby trail towns. The best defence for development encroaching closer and closer to the trail, the trail needs to breakout and counter-attack. We should have green walking, and multi-use trails EVERYWHERE, not just on the AT. This can't happen overnight, but that's eventually where we need to go. There are already some very good examples of this in Europe, and in North America also. We need more of it in North America is all, not just special places like the AT and natinal parks and wilderness areas. Another way to say it is that we need to push back overdevelopment by redeveloping underdevelopment. Also, reduce traffic density by using parrallel trails, and alternative trails.

[JAK]

I would also suggest a lot of private land will need to become National Trust, or Nature Trusts, or some such thing. Not by expropriation, except in extreme cases. There are already good movements underway for people to donate land to such trusts, and receive compensation in the form of tax deductions etc. Usually it is blocks of land, for nature preserves and whatnot, but I can't see why it can't be corridors also. With climate change in particular such corridors are supposed to be essential for migration of plant and animals species North and South, and also up and down in elevation, in response to climate changes. Another thing that should be encouraged which would enhance all of the above is hedgrerows, along property lines, waterways, trails, and roadways. One thing I would like to see less of is empty lawns, and oversized, and overplasticized housing. The AT is a great idea, it just needs to be reinvented, refined, and extended outwards into our neighbourhoods and daily lives.

[The Old Fhart]

Frolicking Dinosaurs-"I have witnessed what Tipi talks about with the 1.5 mile trail at Big Fat -- the area is trashed regularly because people don't want to carry their garbage back up the somewhat steep mile of the trail back to the parking lot."

But that is just hikers exercising their 'right' to ignore the rules. Isn't that exactly what you've been asking for? I know, I know, obeying those pesky laws and regulations is just so, so, "inflexible".

[FatMan]

Move the trail? No. Add to the trail yes.

[rant]I agree that education is important. However overuse, even by those educated does damage to the trail corridor. And overuse is the clear culprit of the problems in my neck of the woods. And unlike many parts of the trail, the majority of the users with the greatest impact are those attempting to thru-hike. Four months from today, the annual pilgrimage of hikers will begin from Springer. Those attempting thru-hikes may count in the thousands over a 2.5 month period. Add to that the day hikers, section hikers, no-clue hikers, and youth groups and what you end up with is a massive herd on the trail. The herd does what herds do. They tear up the earth. They will destroy much of the young spring foilage as they set up tents on any almost level space available. They will compress the soils to the point where nothing will grow. They will kick up the rocks that have held the dirt in place for centuries. It is not that they are not sensitive to the trail, there are just too many in a limited space.[/end rant]

The scenario above is what I see out my back door at Grassy Gap, near Gooch Gap and Woody Gap. And it is representative of the 30.7 mile stretch of trail from Springer to Neels Gap. However, at the exact same time of year, hikers can hike 35 miles from Springer to Neels Gap using the BMT and Duncan Ridge Trail and it is likely they will see less than a handful of other hikers on the trail from the time they leave the AT at Three Forks and arrive back to the AT at Blood Mountain. This section of trails is challenging and IMO more beautifull than the AT section.

The problem in the spring is not the number of people hiking, it is the number of people hiking the same path. I would like to see the ATC take a more broad approach to AT hiking by thinking more in terms of an AT system of trails, not just an AT trail. I cannot speak for the Whites as previously discussed in the thread, but there are plenty of trailways down south that could be developed into alternate routes and incorporated into the system. I know alot of feet will get stepped on in the various trail groups, but the consolidation would be a win-win for the hiking community as a whole in my opinion. At the same time where the AT is struggling to handle the throngs of hikers, these other trail organizations have a desire to increase trail usage. Moving AT hikers to other trails will benefit everyone. And, by creating a system it would allow damaged sections to be closed for periods without having to do complete relocations.

So move the trail? No. Add to the trail yes. Create an Appalachian Trail System, not a single trail. And any hike from Springer to Katahdin within the trail system would qualify for a thru hike.

[JAK]

Stealth camping is not littering.

[wtmntcaretaker]

dont you think by widening, you are asking for more people more trash. if there is heavy traffic on a 2 lane freeway you do not make it a 4 lane freeway . 5 years later there will be traffic jams on the 4 lane road.