RIP Stover Creek Shelter

[rafe]

Totally unecessary shelter. The 7 miles to Hawk are easy. Lots of camping in between

What's your assumed starting point? For those that start at Amicalola, Stover's a respectable first day's hike, and Hawk shelter would be too far.

[Lone Wolf]

Totally unecessary shelter. The 7 miles to Hawk are easy. Lots of camping in between

you are correct. lot of time and money spent for nothing. bragging rights and volunteer hours maybe

[Lone Wolf]

Only with some anti-shelter bigots tied up inside first. Like burning the American flag should arguably only be legal if wrapped around the flag-burning nut.

you're a mere AT pup.

[Smile]

JOHN GAULT: Nitewalker has some pics in his gallery
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/...imageuser=1641

Thanks John

[Tinker]

destroy 'em all

How 'bout "Destroy a Mall?"

[briarpatch]

[quote=Marta;484416]I think it's more a matter of trying to distribute people over a larger area, especially during the spring rush. Sort of like that area in Vermont where there are shelters about every three miles...[/quote

Stover is an overflow shelter for Springer. Hawk is just a bit too far away for someone who has hiked the approach trail, only to find the shelter and meadow at Springer already full.

[A-Train]

What's your assumed starting point? For those that start at Amicalola, Stover's a respectable first day's hike, and Hawk shelter would be too far.

Assuming a start at Springer. If you start at Amicalola you either go to Springer Shelter or move on and camp. The frequent shelters at the beginning of the trek create bad habits and dependency on shelters. There is camping everywhere.

My outlook completely changed after hiking the PCT. No shelters, no security blankets. I actually had to sleep outside every night

[rafe]

Assuming a start at Springer. If you start at Amicalola you either go to Springer Shelter or move on and camp. The frequent shelters at the beginning of the trek create bad habits and dependency on shelters. There is camping everywhere.

I started at Amicalola, and stayed at Stover my first night. I tented the following two nights. I'm no anti-shelter zealot. I generally enjoy the company of others at camp. Not sure what you're refering to as "bad habits." Whatever happened to "HYOH"?

[StarLyte]

Good camping and water source at Three Forks.

(I just remembered that hill going up to Hawk Mountain shelter- that was steep as heck.)

[max patch]

I don't have a "problem" with the new Stover Creek shelter. Where I think the GATC missed the boat was the demolition of the old Stover Creek shelter. I think it should remained standing as a "secret shelter" OR moved to ASP as a "museum" as I understand was being considered as an option.

In any event, the new shelter is a nice one that I've hiked too a couple of times and I'll return again. Here is a brief link to the GATC page discussing the building of the shelter.

http://www.georgia-atclub.org/trailmaintenance.html

[Pedaling Fool]

Are there a good number of campsites at the new Stover Creek Shelter?

[briarpatch]

Are there a good number of campsites at the new Stover Creek Shelter?

There are a number of tent pads available near/at the new shelter.

[briarpatch]

I don't have a "problem" with the new Stover Creek shelter. Where I think the GATC missed the boat was the demolition of the old Stover Creek shelter. I think it should remained standing as a "secret shelter" OR moved to ASP as a "museum" as I understand was being considered as an option.

It was offered as a museum piece, but no one was willing to have it moved. I would have liked to have seen it as a display somewhere, too, but it was just to heavy and in need of repair to move it easily. Leaving it in place would have required a good bit of maintainence to keep it usable/safe, so it came down.

[A-Train]

I started at Amicalola, and stayed at Stover my first night. I tented the following two nights. I'm no anti-shelter zealot. I generally enjoy the company of others at camp. Not sure what you're refering to as "bad habits." Whatever happened to "HYOH"?

I never said don't HYOH. I loved shelters and the comraderie with others. I'm saying this as a former shelter rat. I just think continuing to build these mega shelters isn't solving any problems of overcrowding and impact. Rather than try and keep the impact isolated in a few areas I feel spreading everyone out would be better for the wellbeing of the land. The shelters breed bad habits like folks thinking it's ok to leave trash in fire pits and bringing large groups of folks out to party on weekends.

As far as thru-hikers go, I do think the shelters breed bad habits. Many rely on them and would be a lot more independent without them. It creates bad habits for folks who don't have a proper shelter setup and creates reliance on man-made structures.

I'm just speaking from my own experiences. I became comfortable living in the wilderness on the PCT when I had to find my own camping spots, not follow a simple grid. The AT would be a lot emptier of a place without all the shelters.

[WalkingStick75]

Good and bad go with any topic. At times I avoid shelters opting for my tent or tarp but because of the shelters I have met so many interesting people that I probably would not have if there weren’t any shelters. Then you have the times I had my son with me and that dry place and eating dinner with some degree of comfort made it a good trip instead of a miserable trip. The makeup of the trail is the people, if not for the shelters the social network of hikers just would not be what it is.

[rafe]

The AT would be a lot emptier of a place without all the shelters.

That may well be true. But what good is an empty trail? It was made to be used! And in particular (well, IMO), it was meant to be used by folks that we hard-core hikers might think of as the "wrong kind" of people.

You've hiked multiple long trails, and that's great. But the vast majority of folks who set foot on the AT are there for very short stays.

[SGT Rock]

Shelters are accessories. Saying people won't hike without shelters is like saying people won't buy cars unless they have electric windows. Cars didn't have electric windows for years and people still bought them, and there are a lot of trails without shelters too that people still seem to hike. People just seem to like their electric windows and get ornery when others diss them. Who would of thought people could get so emotional about people dissing their accessories?

[bigboots]

I have no complaints about my new 2007 fuel efficent car that has neither power windows OR power locks. And yes I am a cheap bastard who would rather spend my money on hiking.

Bigboots

[rafe]

As far as thru-hikers go, I do think the shelters breed bad habits. Many rely on them and would be a lot more independent without them. It creates bad habits for folks who don't have a proper shelter setup and creates reliance on man-made structures.

Well, this is the part I take issue with. The "bad habits" part. I'm not an authority on thru-hiker behavior, but ISTM that thru-hikers favor shelters not so much for the structure itself but for the camaraderie. They know that's where their friends will be, or at least where other hikers will be. Chances are most of them will end up at tent sites near the shelter, rather than the shelter itself.

Plus, I don't think any thru-hiker will make it very far without "proper shelter setup." Lacking that is a bad habit in and of itself.

Maybe we could agree that the AT might benefit from a few more semi-developed tent sites?

[SGT Rock]

Well, this is the part I take issue with. The "bad habits" part. I'm not an authority on thru-hiker behavior, but ISTM that thru-hikers favor shelters not so much for the structure itself but for the camaraderie. They know that's where their friends will be, or at least where other hikers will be. Chances are most of them will end up at tent sites near the shelter, rather than the shelter itself.

Plus, I don't think any thru-hiker will make it very far without "proper shelter setup." Lacking that is a bad habit in and of itself.

Maybe we could agree that the AT might benefit from a few more semi-developed tent sites?

Sort of. I think some shelters should be phased out and replaced with those tent sites. Shelters like Icewater for instance would be a great one to replace.