sleeping in shelters

[Engine]

We were staying at the Mt. Collins shelter one particularly mouse infested night when my 10 year old daughter loudly exclaimed "it bit me". A mouse had actually bit her on the hand, hard enough to draw blood. Do you think I ever got her into a shelter again after that?

[mateozzz]

I think it is kind of hard to get an unbiased sampling via a forum, but the opinions are interesting! I have hiked VT, MA, NY, CT sections and mostly slept in shelters, never had a problem with mice, just one stone shelter many years ago. Never had a problem with people, in most cases, I'm glad to see some people show up if they are friendly and want to chat.

Of course, now temper that with your time frame. If you are in the shelter on a holiday weekend, or when 400 thru hikers are coming thru that section, it might get on your nerves to have all these people around (the smell...nuff said). Also, weekends around road crossing bring out locals with alcohol, which increases the odds of conflict.

And for mice, think about it, if a shelter isn't used much or not recently, there probably aren't going to be that many mice left. With no food source, they probably thin out real quick due to snakes and other predators or just moving on. But if it is a busy part of the season, they'll breed exponentionally if there is food and I think that's the basis for a lot of the mouse stories.

[Ox97GaMe]

Almost all thru hikers start out going from shelter to shelter. There is a sense of security with being in a building (more like home) when in the woods. If you read previous years entries 4,5, or 6 months into their hike, you will find that a lot of those hikers are opting for tenting vs. sleeping in a shelter.

As was stated above, you may not get much sleep in a shelter. In a shelter of 12-16people, you are likely to have at least two of the following type of people in the shelter with you.
a) Joe who hikes until dark, then wakes up everybody while he tries to set up in the shelter and cook dinner.
b) John who wants to be on the trail at the crack of dawn, and is banging his pots, pans, and other gear 30 minutes before sunrise.
c) Jim who has to go to the bathroom 3 or 4 times during the night
d) Jake who sits up until midnight reading the shelter log and writing in his journal
e) Jane who is paranoid of mice and flashes her headlamp around the shelter every time she hears a noise.
f) Sam the chronic snorer. Sometimes loud enough to keep everyone within a quarter mile radius awake all night.
g) Mickey the mouse, who is scurrying around all night trying to store away food supplies for the winter.
h) Fido the 4 legged hiker, who moves around every time Joe, Jim, John, Jake, or Jane make any noise or movement, occassionally barks at the creatures walking around in the woods, and has been known to do laps around the shelter chasing Mickey.

There is also the fact that the wood floors are pretty hard and not very giving. A lot of hikers wake up stiff and sore. The ground is usually much softer to sleep on.

Most of the shelters (almost all new/renovated ones in last 5 years) have overhangs or tarps to help keep the rain out. This doesnt mean that rain never gets to the sleeping deck, but it is becoming less of a problem each year.

[Chaco Taco]

1) Head in means not getting your face stepped on in the night.
2) Hang packs always, with all zippers part open (minimizes rodents eating through pack fabric to get inside
3) Try to get a wall. Mousier but better space
4) Cover bottom of sleeping bag with rain cover at night if it is wet
5) Use earplugs
6) Keep boots/shoes next to you
7) Hang food away from shelter

TW

Weasel makes a great point here with earplugs. Some of the time you are going to have hikers that go to sleep super early. Sometimes you want to stay up later than them, or you arrive later, or you are cooking dinner. If you are going to stay in a shelter, bring your own earplugs!!!! Dont get upset when other people are awake and you didnt bring earplugs. I ahve seen it too many times where arguments insue over people staying up past dark around the fire, and hikers yelling out for people to "shut up" Another reasoin why shelters suck

[astrogirl]

As was stated above, you may not get much sleep in a shelter. In a shelter of 12-16people, you are likely to have at least two of the following type of people in the shelter with you.
a) Joe who hikes until dark, then wakes up everybody while he tries to set up in the shelter and cook dinner.
b) John who wants to be on the trail at the crack of dawn, and is banging his pots, pans, and other gear 30 minutes before sunrise.
c) Jim who has to go to the bathroom 3 or 4 times during the night
d) Jake who sits up until midnight reading the shelter log and writing in his journal
e) Jane who is paranoid of mice and flashes her headlamp around the shelter every time she hears a noise.
f) Sam the chronic snorer. Sometimes loud enough to keep everyone within a quarter mile radius awake all night.
g) Mickey the mouse, who is scurrying around all night trying to store away food supplies for the winter.
h) Fido the 4 legged hiker, who moves around every time Joe, Jim, John, Jake, or Jane make any noise or movement, occassionally barks at the creatures walking around in the woods, and has been known to do laps around the shelter chasing Mickey.

Good list - that pretty much sums up the issue - but you forgot about the weekenders and boy scouts.

[Pringles]

When sleeping in a shelter, I always used to sleep with my head out, because I figured the mice would be scampering around the inside walls. I was at the Overmountain Shelter one night, and I heard someone making some noise, and I looked over, and the individual, who was sleeping with his head near the inside of the shelter moved his head just a little, and could look out and see the view of the valley in the moonlight. To do the same, I had to twist way around. Since then, if there's anything at all to see, I sleep with my head toward the back of the shelter so I can see the view. That's why I also like the tents with the bigger side openings... if you leave the vestibule open, you can look out in the night and see the stars, the view, etc..

[Nearly Normal]

Can someone provide some insight into some practical issues having to do with sleeping in shelters? First off - I am guessing that sleeping bags would be positioned perpendicular to the shelter opening with head against back wall and feet towards opening on shelter. Is that the case? Also if there is driving rain which is coming into outer edge of shelter floor, does everyone usually have some tarp with them to keep feet end of bags from getting drenched?

Depends on how many sheltering.
Take your own.

[Skyline]

Whether to sleep in shelters, or not?

IMHO it has a lot to do with both energy level and skill level. If you get to a shelter dead tired the last thing you may want to do is set up a tent if a space in the shelter beckons. And if you haven't quite mastered life in a tent, in all weather conditions, you may take the path of least resistance and head for the shelter.

Many thru-hikers become mile-slaves so anything that interferes with getting in the max every day is the enemy. That time spent setting up and taking down a tent is time that could be better put to use gaining two more miles to Katahdin (or Springer).

Drawing from personal experience and myriad comments here there are good reasons to not sleep in shelters. Health-wise. Sleep-wise. Avoiding aggravation-wise. But there are other reasons that seem to supercede these, and that's why shelters exist.

[Gumbi]

Can someone provide some insight into some practical issues having to do with sleeping in shelters?

Yup. Don't do it.

[Tin Man]

Whether to sleep in shelters, or not?

IMHO it has a lot to do with both energy level and skill level. If you get to a shelter dead tired the last thing you may want to do is set up a tent if a space in the shelter beckons. And if you haven't quite mastered life in a tent, in all weather conditions, you may take the path of least resistance and head for the shelter.

Many thru-hikers become mile-slaves so anything that interferes with getting in the max every day is the enemy. That time spent setting up and taking down a tent is time that could be better put to use gaining two more miles to Katahdin (or Springer).

Drawing from personal experience and myriad comments here there are good reasons to not sleep in shelters. Health-wise. Sleep-wise. Avoiding aggravation-wise. But there are other reasons that seem to supercede these, and that's why shelters exist.

Huh?? If it takes you 40-60 minutes to setup and take down a tent, then maybe you need a different sport. If you can hike all day, setting up and taking down a tent is nothing.

[Two Speed]

Ayup. Been my experience that "mouse proofing" at night and then retrieving/unwrapping/repacking in the morning takes just about as much time as pitching and striking a tent. As far as I'm concerned any time saved by sleeping in a shelter is marginal, at best.

[Gumbi]

Also, be sure to bring a tent or some other shelter for when it rains.

Invariably, someone else will come to the already full shelter in the rain and ask you to move out so that he/she can sleep in the shelter because he/she didn't bring a tent or tarp.

If so asked, you should kindly repack your belongings, and set your tent up outside in the rain so that the hardcore, lightweight backpacker can avoid hypothermia.

[Engine]

Also, be sure to bring a tent or some other shelter for when it rains.

Invariably, someone else will come to the already full shelter in the rain and ask you to move out so that he/she can sleep in the shelter because he/she didn't bring a tent or tarp.

If so asked, you should kindly repack your belongings, and set your tent up outside in the rain so that the hardcore, lightweight backpacker can avoid hypothermia.

A true "Hardcore" lightweight backpacker will be carrying a tent or tarp from SMD or Tarptent that weighs around 1-2 pounds and will likely be found well away from the shelter since they are too busy enjoying the experience to have it spoiled by a loud, filthy, stinky shelter...

[CowHead]

I only stay in the shelter if 1 no one else is there and two it startes to rain/snow/hail

[FlyPaper]

One other small consideration. Most sleeping platforms in the shelters have a slight downward tilt going toward the opening. It is hard to detect, but I have a special sense for such things (it's my gift). This may be important if you're prone to head congestion or acid reflux.

[flemdawg1]

But there are other reasons that seem to supercede these, and that's why shelters exist.

I'd say the biggest reasons for staying in a shelter are water sources, privy, picnic tables, bear cables and to be social.

[Lone Wolf]

I'd say the biggest reasons for staying in a shelter are water sources, privy, picnic tables, bear cables and to be social.

and just plain laziness

[Tin Man]

flemdawg[/LEFT]1;825769]I'd say the biggest reasons for staying in a shelter are water sources, privy, picnic tables, bear cables and to be social.

you don't need to stay INSIDE the shelter to enjoy these amenities

[Skyline]

Huh?? If it takes you 40-60 minutes to setup and take down a tent, then maybe you need a different sport. If you can hike all day, setting up and taking down a tent is nothing.

Not saying it takes me that long, but it might take a newbie or someone who hasn't made friends with his or her tent that long or longer. Many in those categories are thru-hikers who become shelter rats early on and never really develop tenting/tarping/hammocking skills.

FWIW, I usually take about 5-7 minutes to put up or take down my single-wall tent. Less if raining. Choosing and/or preparing the site takes more time than putting it up.

[Skyline]

I'd say the biggest reasons for staying in a shelter are water sources, privy, picnic tables, bear cables and to be social.

Those are valid reasons too. But you can tent within a tenth-mile or more from the shelter and get all those things, too. Best of both worlds.