Hiker rescued from Mahoosuc Notch

[The Scribe]

Geek,

Thanks. I do understand the how's and why's of hypothermia, and asked the question so that the writer could give a first-hand account of how, in the middle of July, he became hypothermic nevertheless with all the gear at his disposal.

I asked about the helicopters because New Hampshire emergency services have a fleet of helicopters paid for by its taxpayers for use in rescues of just this type.

There is a concern, however, that they are undependable and not properly maintained. It's important to know this when hiking in that area, since it is quite easy to be highly trained and prepared for your hike, yet nevertheless encounter circumstances which require your rescue.

It is, without any doubt, the authorities' responsibility to be able to conduct a proper helicopter rescue of anyone hiking NH mountains. We train, equip and pay NH emergency officials to do precisely that, and if they can't perform the task, we need to find folks who can.

The more public attention which is brought onto NH authorities inability to conduct a proper helicopter rescue the better, in my view. The Golden Hour is breached when someone is required to be transported 10 miles over fire road via ambulance instead of properly med-evac'd out by helicopter.

(It's understandable they couldn't get a basket down to where this guy was laying, but unbelieveable that they couldn't get a chopper transport of a hypothermic patient with head injuries.)

Buckwheat, I see you're still at it. Can you please provide a link or other information to back your point that NH's helicopter fleet is undependable and not properly maintained. And I think you have asserted in another thread, mismanaged.

If in fact that's the case, you have my apologies, but I would like to see where you get your information from.

Ironically, before I read your post, I toyed with the idea of a sarcastic post wondering if Maine's helicopter fleet was mismanaged and unreliable as well or does maybe Maine outsource the work to NH?

I am surprised you haven't made the point that Maine isn't sending the guy a bill. Maine is the polar opposite of NH. Maine welcomes everyone, takes care of everyone, then has no money to take care of anyone.

[buckwheat]

Scribe,

I've written that there is a concern that NH rescue helicopters are undependable, and that maintenance of the small fleet is likely one of the reasons. There is a paucity of data available, except what I've been reading in local newspapers.

Keep in mind that New Hampshire is a state that spends millions of dollars annually advertising to convince people to come climb its mountains in the summer and ski on them in the winter. Many New Hampshire communities would not exist if it were not for the tourist dollars that the state brings in through its advertising.

The state spends millions each year on building parks for the tourists and charging for campsites and entrance fees. Many New Hampshire citizens enjoy an excellent living off the tourists the state convinces to come. Absolutely nothing wrong with that.

However, the state of New Hampshire then has a moral obligation to provide emergency medical services to the people it invites to partake of dangerous activities on its mountains, in my view. Frequently, it is unable to do so ... as in the case of this hiker, who had to be transported via 4-wheel-drive ambulance because a helicopter was unavailable. (News reports don't say why, which is why I'm asking so many questions of the OP about that issue).

There's a philosophy in emergency medical treatment called the "Golden Hour" which basically posits that in trauma cases such as you might find when people have fallen off a New Hampshire mountain and become hypothermic, the authorities need to get the patient to a hospital within "the golden hour" to maximize their chances for survival.

Helicopters make that possible in New Hampshire, where frequently you are 50 or more miles from a hospital to begin with (not to mention that you might be on the side of a mountain).

New Hampshire citizens make lots of money from the hikers and skiers, who bring their families to the state to enjoy the outdoors; many at the urging of the state of New Hampshire. Some of that money should be put into making sure it's a safe place to bring your family.

New Hampshire is frequently having to call upon helicopters in other states (Vermont and Maine most often, but also Massachusetts). This is a great deal for New Hampshire, because it puts the cost onus on the taxpayers in other states.

But it's a deadly practice and it raises the question whether the state is putting greed ahead of the effectiveness of emergency operations in New Hampshire.

It's pretty clear to me that the state of New Hampshire does not have enough rescue helicopters. Here is a news article concerning one of two which was recently moved further south away from the White Mountains to extreme southern New Hampshire. Concerns are expressed in the article whether this is a good idea and reduces response times.

I hike in New Hampshire, and spend a considerable sum doing so and am concerned about why frequently I read that a rescue helicopter was unable to transport hikers and skiers who need emergency medical transportation.

Hope that explains my concerns.

[wrongway_08]

Was under the idea that the helicopter was not able to get to him due to the trees, not for any other reason?

You cant get to everyone everytime.

I dont think its a moral obligation to get to them. If they can, thats great but weather, trees and other factors effecting the safety of the rescuers comes first.

[mudhead]

That is what I read. The clearing is big enough for a small group to stand around in, but is down in there. Like a liquor box.

The trail they took him down is also heavily wooded. I would be satisfied if they hauled me out that way.

Might be a few ANG choppers on desert duty.

[janiebeth]

Billski, I am so glad that you are recovering from your ordeal. I am Steven's ( Root Beer Float) Mom. I am so proud of him and I thank God for putting him in the right place at the right time.

[billski]

That is what I read. The clearing is big enough for a small group to stand around in, but is down in there. Like a liquor box.

The trail they took him down is also heavily wooded. I would be satisfied if they hauled me out that way.

Might be a few ANG choppers on desert duty.

I honestly had no idea how grave my condition was until I was in the hospital. The rescue team was desperately looking for the fastest way out. This wasn't a broken leg that can wait.

While the terrain made any helicopter drop impossible, the Maine ANG copter was deployed to the middle east. The first responders sent scouts up the mountains to view for sites, even before they requested a helicopter. There were jurisdictional issues because I entered in NH, fell in Maine, but was retrieved through NH. Its my understanding NH F&G was in charge. Regardless, the state teams worked seamlessly.

The problem with that clearing, was that when the copter hovers above, it creates such downdraft that the trees bend, making the space even more constricted. Too much chance for entanglement.

I was 100% behind all the rescue decision made (did I have I choice?). What I mean is that the best decisions were made in all cases.

---
Separate Thought
---
While I have no interest in self-aggrandizement, I do hope that readers of this story will all learn from it. First, it can happen to anyone anytime, anywhere, even right in your house. Second, all those Hike Safe guidelines are 100% on the mark.

Third lesson, is if you are rescued or assisted please say THANK YOU. Thank yous are free. It is amazing as I call the various rescue groups that they acknowledge that the majority of those served never send a thank you note or card. These guys disrupted their day, did difficult laborious work, and may have even put their own lives at risk. A little appreciation goes a long way. You want them there if you ever need them.


Bill

[billski]

Billski, I am so glad that you are recovering from your ordeal. I am Steven's ( Root Beer Float) Mom. I am so proud of him and I thank God for putting him in the right place at the right time.

Janiebeth,
Yes, you deserve to be so proud. Steve and Dave were my "Trail Angels" if ever there were ones, thank God. I hope he got all his equipment back. I will be forever indebted to them, I very well may not have made it that day. Thankfully, we all have a story to tell from this.

[buckwheat]

Was under the idea that the helicopter was not able to get to him due to the trees, not for any other reason? You cant get to everyone everytime.

Using a helicopter to remove someone from the mountain is one thing. Many times, that's not possible due to obstacles.

It is an altogether different thing when no helicopter is available at all ... not even to perform the important task of transporting a hypothermic patient to the hospital after they've been carried to the trailhead.

Frequently, I'm reading, a helicopter is unavailable in New Hampshire, or must be brought from another state. That's unacceptable when the state of New Hampshire lures people to the state to hike and ski and makes so much money off hikers and other sportsmen.

[Snowleopard]

A hiker was just carried out by helicopter from the Caps Ridge Trail on Mt. Jefferson, NH. http://unionleader.com/article.aspx?...e-c6d02018b0e3 To illustrate the difficulties of using a helicopter, someone posted this picture of the Caps Ridge Trail on the newspaper's web site:

[Jack Tarlin]

Buckwheat:

I have several friends who work at the nearby Dartmouth-Hitchcock medical facility, which may be the finest hospital in New England outside of Boston.

Among other things, this place has one of the top-rated orthopedic departments in the country, and they treat a great many outdoor-related injuries: In Northern New England, this is THE go-to place for accidents or emergencies involving climbing; skiiing; hiking; snowmobiling, etc.

Medevac choppers fly in and out of here all the time.

But the fact of the matter is that whether the aircraft is operated by an indidual hospital; a private company; or even a State Government, maintaining and flying helicopters is an extraordinarily expensive undertaking, and there will always be times when choppers aren't immediately available for one reason or another. Different States therefore frequently rely on help from their neighbors, just as city and town Fire Departments help each other out on many occasions.

But whether or not the helicopter in question comes from New Hampshire or somewhere else, someone's gotta pay for these things, and if it is determined that an individual's own behavior or recklessness contributed to their problems (including medical costs associated with their problems), then I see no reason why they shouldn't be expected to pay their own bills.

And lastly, I think you're a bit over the top with your comments about people being "lured" into coming to New Hampshire by the insidious folks who work for the Department of Tourism. Nobody in Masssachusetts is forced to come up here, and when one goes backpacking, one does so knowing that there are implied inherent risks involved with the activity.

But blaming the State of New Hampshire because they "lure" Bay Staters up here is kinda silly. If I travel down to Boston to see a Sox game or to visit friends, and if I tripped on the sidewalk during my visit, I'd most likely blame myself. I kinda doubt it would ever enter my mind to go after the Massachusetts Bureau of Travel and Tourism because they enticed me into making the visit. Yes, Massachusetts, like New Hampshire, is a wonderful place to visit, but nobody is forced to visit either place, so blaming a State government for one's bad luck or misfortune seems less than fair to me.

[Yahtzee]

Jack, not sure that tripping on a sidewalk on the way to a RedSox game is analogous to getting hurt while hiking. Maybe, say, getting hit by a ball at a Red Sox game because Fenway didn't put up any screens. Either way, it is NH's right to provide whatever services they like to its citizens and its visitors. At some pt. tho, all governments do a cost/benefit analysis as to whether a regulation/policy will, in fact, invite more tax dollars than it would expend. I'm thinking, lifeguards at the beach. At this pt., it seems NH has decided that to provide this service is an unnecessary expense.

[Jack Tarlin]

Unnecessary expense?

Actually, the State allocates thousands of dollars a year to emergency services, Search & Rescue operations, etc.

It is truly astounding to see to much expert information on the State of New Hampshire provided by people who don't live here.

[Snowleopard]

But the fact of the matter is that whether the aircraft is operated by an indidual hospital; a private company; or even a State Government, maintaining and flying helicopters is an extraordinarily expensive undertaking, and there will always be times when choppers aren't immediately available for one reason or another. Different States therefore frequently rely on help from their neighbors, just as city and town Fire Departments help each other out on many occasions.

Owning and operating a helicopter is too expensive for NH to keep one on call specifically for injured or lost outdoors people. How many hiker/climber/skier rescues happen in a summer week? 1? 2? 3? Maybe enough to keep the copter in the air for a few hours a week. Most of the usage of helicopters would be for traffic accidents or other medical emergencies not related to outdoors sports.

I used to work at the UMass Medical School in Worcester. The outdoor lunch area was next to the helipad and lunch conversation was often interrupted by the helicopter; there were many flights per day.

It must be really tough to carry someone down the Caps Ridge Trail. Mahoosuc Notch is supposedly tougher. I'm really grateful for the SAR people and volunteer litter carriers in these rescues. Next time it could be me or you that needs to be carried out.

[Yahtzee]

Do they provide helicopter service to all injured hikers who could use one? No. Then NH has decided that is an unnecessary expense. Very simple. Don't need to live in NH to figure that one out. Nor do you need to be an expert.

[The Old Fhart]

buckwheat-"Thanks. I do understand the how's and why's of hypothermia, and asked the question so that the writer could give a first-hand account of how, in the middle of July, he became hypothermic nevertheless with all the gear at his disposal."

You obviously don’t understand hypothermia or you wouldn’t repeatedly ask such inane questions. Once again I suggest you read this WB article on hypothermia (which I wrote) where it will tell you that someone with medical conditions, i.e., a concussion, could easily become hypothermic where a uninjured person under the same conditions would be fine. I have actually seen where a A.T. hiker south of Sunrise Mountain slipped and fell, knocking himself unconscious, landing in a couple of inches of water on a 90 degree day and was hypothermic when found.

buckwheat-"I asked about the helicopters because New Hampshire emergency services have a fleet of helicopters paid for by its taxpayers for use in rescues of just this type.

There is a concern, however, that they are undependable and not properly maintained. It's important to know this when hiking in that area, since it is quite easy to be highly trained and prepared for your hike, yet nevertheless encounter circumstances which require your rescue.

Just where do you come up with this B.S.? Once again, New Hampshire doesn’t have an “air fleet” as you continually claim. Please tell us who owns this so-called fleet and where it is located. What you will find if you actually research the issue is that helicopter service for rescue is provided by the ANG (if available) or Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center. This so-called “air fleet” exists only in your mind.

buckwheat-"It is, without any doubt, the authorities' responsibility to be able to conduct a proper helicopter rescue of anyone hiking NH mountains. We train, equip and pay NH emergency officials to do precisely that, and if they can't perform the task, we need to find folks who can.

How about some facts to support your wild-azz claim. Who is the "we" that "train, equip and pay NH emergency officials" and who are these officials? Must be the Illuminari because you're the only one who knows of them.

If you can't provide any facts to support these stories you make up you could at least stop trolling and let the rest of the posters have a reasonable discussion.

[billski]

I have spent a good deal of time researching the various responding SAR groups this past week in order to thank them all. In the final analysis, NH F&G is not equipped, funded or staffed to perform a full rescue of anyone. While F&G is ultimately responsible, it takes a quickly-formed collection of agencies and volunteers to be successful.

The NH outdoor council http://www.nhoutdoorcouncil.org/ is the focal point of SAR teams for the state. The vast majority of members are volunteers. Read any accounting of who participated in rescue operations and you will always see these groups mentioned.

What this suggests is that indeed state SAR coordination duties are the responsibility of the state, but as is often the case, they are underfunded and greatly depend on volunteers.

This is a bigger issue than SAR funding. It's a political issue. It speaks to how funds are appropriated at the state level for all agencies. Our esteemed legislators continually pass laws and fail to provide adequate funding for these laws. If they cannot even fund enough feet on the mountain to conduct a rescue, they never will be able to fund air transportation. Talk to your legislator in your state. It's the same problem everywhere. Become an advocate. Lobby to make it a priority.

[max patch]

And lastly, I think you're a bit over the top with your comments about people being "lured" into coming to New Hampshire by the insidious folks who work for the Department of Tourism.

Hanover was named one of the best places to live in the USA this month by Money Magazine.

[Lone Wolf]

Hanover was named one of the best places to live in the USA this month by Money Magazine.

yeah. for wealthy people not average joe

[celt]

yeah. for wealthy people not average joe

Baltimore Jack= wealthy with A.T. info?

[Lone Wolf]

Baltimore Jack= wealthy with A.T. info?

yeah sure. that is exactly what i was thinking