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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desert Reprobate View Post
    . . . then got back up and ran across the street and jumped in the lake. End of shock collar.
    Smart dog. Fortunately there aren't any lakes close to home so that won't be a problem for me.

    Seriously, using a shock collar for amusement? Way wrong, wrong in so many ways. Use it to correct entrenched and undesirable behavior? Maybe. Haven't decided yet.
    Me no care, me here free beer. Tap keg, please?

  2. #22
    Registered User drifters quest's Avatar
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    I think this thread is full of some great information. I have a border collie which is great because although she likes to explore she never goes far and when we are hiking I tell her to "wait" and she comes and stays behind me. She is very intelligent which has its' advantages and disadvantes- she picks things up very quickly but her sensitivity can make her suspicous and she hates getting in trouble (once again good and bad at the same time). I think all dogs are different and if I put a shock collar on her she would shut down. I know another dog however that it would probably work quite well with.

    I think when training a dog for the trail a few things that come to mind that are important are:

    1. Fitness: make sure the dog can hike what you are asking him to hike
    2. Socialization (people, dogs, other animals). This was the hardest for my dog since I got her when she was already a year without a lot of socialization but she does quite well now and enjoys trips to the dog park and I have even taken her for walks in the University district in downtown Seattle. The hardest for her though is in the woods when she hears somebody approaching and sees movement but doesn't know what it is she naturally gets suspicous.
    3. In camp behavior: I suppose everyones different with this but I don't like my dog to wander off in camp.. I always want to be able to see her. If she doesn't settle down I tie her up but lately she has been very good and lays down in camp.
    4. Tenting: make sure your dog is used to whatever sleeping arrangements you have; it could be a long night otherwise.
    5. Other: if you are in a place where you have to cross water, make sure your dog doesn't mind or be prepared for a backup plan. I'm not sure how Kelly will do with water since it's too cold here to practice but most border collies enjoy it. Make sure your dog is acclimated to the weather conditions of the hike.

  3. #23
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    I'll throw one other consideration at you: Barney is very well trained to hike with me solo. Knows what he can get away with and what I expect. In a group he'll try to find the softest heart in the crowd and "obey" that person. Should have hiked with groups while he was still young.
    Me no care, me here free beer. Tap keg, please?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by yappy View Post
    a shock collar ? that is awful. I saw a guy use that once and the dog was completely terrified. The guy thought it was pretty cool and he used it way too much. I have had a dog on hikes and she stays w me cuz she WANTS to not cuz she has too. I let her run free and explore cuz that is what dogs DO. Hello ???? that might be the first thing you want to understand. Their noses are so exquisite that is is cruel not to allow them to roam some. Please pleaseeeeee do us all a favor and don't bring your dog if they are going to be on a leash for 2000 freaking miles. My God.. I am consistantly amazed at what people will do to an innocent animal.

    What in the world is WITH people?? WHY..WHY..do people feel that dogs can't be happy on a leash?? That type of attitude (thats just what dogs do..roam..blah blah) is how dogs get in trouble, and why some people HATE dogs on trails, parks, etc. When you are out in a place were the public has access to, your dog should be LEASHED! You want him to run? Throw the ball for him in your back yard, or jog with him.

    Im sure dogs WOULD love running hog wild all over the place, getting into whatever, scaring wildlife or people who dont like dogs half to death. BUT..responsible owners dont let them do that. And dont get me started with the "voice control' thing. YAH okay. Everybody thinks they have voice control, until they are proved wrong.

    And what is this "their noses are so exquisite that its cruel to keep them on a leash"???? Cruel to keep them on a leash cause they like to sniff??? Dogs like to hump folks legs too. Should we allow them to do this too?? This is why we have the issues with dogs that we do. It's NOT the dogs fault..its owners who have NO clue.

    I am constantly amazed at the ignorance of dog owners.

    And YES..I AM a dog owner who takes her dogs to parks, hiking etc, ALWAYS leashed. And they dont seem "miserable" to me! FAR from it!
    Sheesh..get a 20 foot leash or something if you want to let the dog veer off from you a bit. But, you still have the ability to reel him in quick if need be. Works just fine for me.

  5. #25
    Registered User cowboy nichols's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Highpointbound View Post
    What in the world is WITH people?? WHY..WHY..do people feel that dogs can't be happy on a leash?? That type of attitude (thats just what dogs do..roam..blah blah) is how dogs get in trouble, and why some people HATE dogs on trails, parks, etc. When you are out in a place were the public has access to, your dog should be LEASHED! You want him to run? Throw the ball for him in your back yard, or jog with him.

    Im sure dogs WOULD love running hog wild all over the place, getting into whatever, scaring wildlife or people who dont like dogs half to death. BUT..responsible owners dont let them do that. And dont get me started with the "voice control' thing. YAH okay. Everybody thinks they have voice control, until they are proved wrong.

    And what is this "their noses are so exquisite that its cruel to keep them on a leash"???? Cruel to keep them on a leash cause they like to sniff??? Dogs like to hump folks legs too. Should we allow them to do this too?? This is why we have the issues with dogs that we do. It's NOT the dogs fault..its owners who have NO clue.

    I am constantly amazed at the ignorance of dog owners.

    And YES..I AM a dog owner who takes her dogs to parks, hiking etc, ALWAYS leashed. And they dont seem "miserable" to me! FAR from it!
    Sheesh..get a 20 foot leash or something if you want to let the dog veer off from you a bit. But, you still have the ability to reel him in quick if need be. Works just fine for me.
    RIGHT ON!!!!!

  6. #26
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    Blissful,
    I would start by saying that lots of exercise is the key. Trying to train a dog after they have been locked in the house all day will be less productive than working on the obedience stuff after a good run. Use lots of positive reinforcement: food and attention. I bought my dog a pack when she was quite young and made her wear it every time she went out. She associates the pack with going for a walk now. If I start to pack up camping or climbing gear she gets a little high strung but when I pull out her pack and show it to her she calms down very quickly. She walks behind me and is not allowed to go first. This means that I see all people, dogs, wildlife and water sources first. To teach her this I would put her pack on her and walk with hiking poles. Most trails are narrow enough that when she would try to sneak around me I would feel her pack brush against my leg and then whack her with a hiking pole. A 6-8’ leash might be helpful for the training phase which can be attached to your hip-belt so you don’t have to carry it. I find that she is a much more well behaved dog with a pack on— I don’t put much weight in it though; I find that a water bottle on each side and snacks (hers and mine) work well. The water bottles make it easy to ensure that the pack is well balanced.

    Highpointbound,

    Saying that all dogs need to be on leashes is about as extreme as saying leashes are cruel. Your dog might need a leash. Mine does not. For your claim that dogs are under voice control until they prove their owner wrong: I would politely say that if your dog is not aggressive and doesn’t damage someone else’s property it doesn’t matter if they end up out of control once or twice in their short lives.

    “running hog wild”—If it’s legal what’s the problem

    “getting into whatever”--If my dog gets skunked or stuck by a porcupine it’s my issue to deal with not yours

    “scaring wildlife”—Wildlife should run if they see people or dogs it keeps them safe. And for the occasional deer that is taken down by a dog; it’s natural selection at work. The species is not in jeopardy so in the big picture it does not hurt anything.

    “scaring people who don’t like dogs”—If the dog acts aggressive it’s totally unacceptable and does not belong in public places. If someone is simply scared by the sight of a dog then they should probably avoid hiking trails.

    I’m not advocating for people to allow their poorly behaved dogs to run freely through crowded hiking trails and shelters. I thoroughly understand how bad dogs limit access to public resources for owners who have well behaved dogs. I also agree that it is disrespectful to others on the trail. But the argument that a well behaved dog might do something wrong someday so should be leashed all the time to prevent that does not make sense to me. All of the above things that are listed are inappropriate and not something I would allow my dog to do. But if it happens someday it really is not a big deal. I’ve done an AT hike and two on the Long Trail and have never seen the anti-dog / leash issues that seen to dominate this section of the forum. On some other thread I saw someone suggesting a hiker carry wasp spray to deal with dogs on the trail…If you need to walk through the woods in such fear of household pets that you carry wasp spray your time might be better spent with a therapist. I think some of this stuff might be more of an internet problem than a real world problem.

    Jason Guess
    Conway NH

  7. #27
    See you at Springer, Winter 09' Chance09's Avatar
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    I hiked with a few different people who had dogs on the AT last year and I just have two things you may want to think about.

    A lot of people train dogs to walk beside them while taking walks around town/sidewalk/road/ect. On the AT in a lot of places this isn't practical due to trial width so you may want to train your dog to walk behind or in front of you as well.

    I hiked with a guy who had trained his dog to sleep on it's own sleeping pad. The dog then always knew that that was it's space and it wouldn't be bothered there. I thought it was a pretty good idea.
    AT - Georgia to Maine '09
    PCT - Mexico to Canada '10
    CDT - Canada to Mexico '11


  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason View Post
    Blissful,
    I would start by saying that lots of exercise is the key. Trying to train a dog after they have been locked in the house all day will be less productive than working on the obedience stuff after a good run. Use lots of positive reinforcement: food and attention. I bought my dog a pack when she was quite young and made her wear it every time she went out. She associates the pack with going for a walk now. If I start to pack up camping or climbing gear she gets a little high strung but when I pull out her pack and show it to her she calms down very quickly. She walks behind me and is not allowed to go first. This means that I see all people, dogs, wildlife and water sources first. To teach her this I would put her pack on her and walk with hiking poles. Most trails are narrow enough that when she would try to sneak around me I would feel her pack brush against my leg and then whack her with a hiking pole. A 6-8’ leash might be helpful for the training phase which can be attached to your hip-belt so you don’t have to carry it. I find that she is a much more well behaved dog with a pack on— I don’t put much weight in it though; I find that a water bottle on each side and snacks (hers and mine) work well. The water bottles make it easy to ensure that the pack is well balanced.

    Highpointbound,

    Saying that all dogs need to be on leashes is about as extreme as saying leashes are cruel. Your dog might need a leash. Mine does not. For your claim that dogs are under voice control until they prove their owner wrong: I would politely say that if your dog is not aggressive and doesn’t damage someone else’s property it doesn’t matter if they end up out of control once or twice in their short lives.

    “running hog wild”—If it’s legal what’s the problem

    “getting into whatever”--If my dog gets skunked or stuck by a porcupine it’s my issue to deal with not yours

    “scaring wildlife”—Wildlife should run if they see people or dogs it keeps them safe. And for the occasional deer that is taken down by a dog; it’s natural selection at work. The species is not in jeopardy so in the big picture it does not hurt anything.

    “scaring people who don’t like dogs”—If the dog acts aggressive it’s totally unacceptable and does not belong in public places. If someone is simply scared by the sight of a dog then they should probably avoid hiking trails.

    I’m not advocating for people to allow their poorly behaved dogs to run freely through crowded hiking trails and shelters. I thoroughly understand how bad dogs limit access to public resources for owners who have well behaved dogs. I also agree that it is disrespectful to others on the trail. But the argument that a well behaved dog might do something wrong someday so should be leashed all the time to prevent that does not make sense to me. All of the above things that are listed are inappropriate and not something I would allow my dog to do. But if it happens someday it really is not a big deal. I’ve done an AT hike and two on the Long Trail and have never seen the anti-dog / leash issues that seen to dominate this section of the forum. On some other thread I saw someone suggesting a hiker carry wasp spray to deal with dogs on the trail…If you need to walk through the woods in such fear of household pets that you carry wasp spray your time might be better spent with a therapist. I think some of this stuff might be more of an internet problem than a real world problem.

    Jason Guess
    Conway NH

    you stop that! you're not allowed to make sense here!




    jk. that is probably the most well-written response i have ever read. thanks.

  9. #29
    Registered User Wise Old Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tppreston View Post
    I follow the same training and etiquette - leash them when you see other people. I also have a pack for my dog. She carries her own water, bowl and treats. By why is it they always want to pass you on the most narrow part of the trail? Although obvious, make sure they have a good collar and ID. They always seem to make their own solo trips when their collar is off - go figure?
    Before the trail narrows I say "OUT in Front" or OUT and the dog takes a twenty foot pace in front of me. That was the length of the original leash and if the dog gets too far I just whistle him back.
    Dogs are excellent judges of character, this fact goes a long way toward explaining why some people don't like being around them.

    Woo

  10. #30
    Registered User thelowend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blissful View Post
    Not sure I understand. If you are hiking along with the dog for miles how will it be miserable and not covering enough ground? You mean it won't be able to just go and roam freely? We are working with her right now on walking and owner control so she knows she can't roam free, along with distractions, etc. I know it will take time which is why I am doing it now before the hiking season. I'd think the dog would be more miserable here at home outside, chained and not going anywhere.

    First, off, you are making me jealous because just about a month ago, I came across the most beautiful bluetick coon hound in Rich Mountain wilderness but the owner ended up finding us.. .. I wanted him...
    anyways...

    I can tell you now that you are going to want that dog voice trained VERY WELL. I have come across a few coon hounds in my hiking and dog store experiences and would like to reiterate that they like to roam and aren't exactly "follow the leader" type dogs (unless you are the consistent, everpresent leader that they need).. If you can get her voice trained, you can let her off the leash and just leash her up when you encounter other dogs/hikers. I almost have my black lab voice trained (still more of vocal guidance at this point) and I let her loose on most trails and as soon as I see a hiker/runner/dog/whatever, I use the Come command (she hasn't disobeyed me yet on the trail with "Come") and hold her collar or leash her up until we are out of ear/eye/nose shot.

  11. #31
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    I've had really good luck with a training collar to make my dog attentive to my commands. Like come when it gets too far away and sit when someone or another dog approaches. It took a few electric stimulations but now I send only a tone and she returns, sits, whatever. Really handy when other people or dogs around to cause a distraction. It's nice to let the dog off leash and be able to trust it. It takes some work and time but with my dog it seemed to work out.


    http://securepets.com/train.html
    Last edited by mark schofield; 03-11-2010 at 07:56. Reason: adding text

  12. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by kanga View Post
    i've had several different types of coon dogs and they are different from other dogs. they are not happy being leashed all the time and they will mope to let you know it. they are ramblers and are not happy staying directly beside you the whole time, like a retriever would. 20 miles is nothing to them.
    Yea this is kinda what I thought. Coons can cover about 3 times more ground than humans in half the time. I notice they run out and back out and back

  13. #33

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    We will be getting a pure German Shepherd joining us this fall. Cant wait!!!!

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