tent advice

[harvcore]

hey
thanks to all that replied to my earlier post--now the time to pick a tent--lots to consider so thats why im posting here for advice. i guess the decisions im faced with are as follows--weight vs. comfort vs. practicallity. the 3 tents that im choosing from are as follows

sierra designs clip flashlight(light weight but small vestible for storage)
dana design arja(kinda heavy but large vestibles)
mountain hardwear muir trail(middle of the road for both weight and storage)

i guess my biggest deliemma is what to look for when choosing a tent--should i be more concerned with comfort or should i be most concerned about weight(the difference between all 3 tents im considering is about 2 pounds max)
this will be my girlfriends and my first serious hike on the AT so im kinda in the dark but i figure with 2 people the consideration should be comfort over wieght--once again thanks in advance for any help offered--harvey

[MOWGLI]

Harvey, only you and your companion can answer the comfort vs. weight question. Suggest you go to an outfitter that has all of these tents and lie down in each one - both of you that is. If you are in Eastern PA, Campmor in Paramus, NJ is not that far a ride. Remember, you're gonna have to schlep that tent over 2100+ miles. That's alot of sweat, and alot of mountains. Once you see how you fit in each tent, and add the weight & cost part of the equation, you'll come up with your answer. Best of luck.

[Jumpstart]

Hi Harv,

My husband and I carried the Walrus Arch Rival XV until Manchester Center, VT, we split the way between the two of us (he carried tent body and poles, I carried the fly and the stakes. It was a great tent, lots of room and under 2 pounds for each of us. We switched it out in Manchester Center becuase it started to leak through the floor, and switched to an EMS Milk Way, which we used for the rest of the trail, about 5 pounds and split that up between us both as well. Both tents had plenty of room for two, we used to bring both our packs inside at night and use them under our feet, and the Milky Way, especially, was almost all mesh, so it never got too "cramped".

One thing you defintely will want to look at if you are sheltering as a couple is if you can comfortably roll over at the same time without elbowing each other in the eye, and also, if you can "do your thing", whether it is taking out contact lenses, pulling on clothing, etc, while relatively staying out of each others way. For this reasons, we chose a tent that was a little heavier (though under two pounds for each was not a burden by any means) and it was worth every ounce. It can bring a lot of harmony to your hiking union if you aren't "right on top of each other" for every second you are in the tent, especially after days and days with no shower in the summer

[Peaks]

I can't stress the importance of trying on different tents. Not only by crawling into them.

Spread out sleeping pads, spread out sleeping bags, bring in your stuff that you want inside the tent. Find a place for your pack at night. Find a place for your boots at night. etc. Then, crawl inside and figure out how you are going to do "your thing." Also, figure out how you are going to cook on a rainy evening.

The Clip Flashlight does work for many couples. But it is also small for many others.

Like they say, only you can answer the questions about size and what's comfortable for you two.

[chris]

Note that Walrus was bought out by MSR and the Zoid is the new incarnation of the Arch Rival, a tent that I use alot. Also, the Clipflash Lite and the Arch Rival are very similar in terms of design.

[ez-does-it]

Hi,
Try this web site and check out the 2-4-2 at www.wanderlustgear.com
I saw a lot of people using this tent as partners and they were very happy with it. I have the Nomad-Lite and love it.
There is a phone number in the web site so you can call Kurt Russell and ask him all your questions.Good luck in your search.

[The Weasel]

Tent weight, especially, is the worst issue of all, I think. It's usually the single heaviest item in your pack, and even sharing it with a partner, once you know there are lighter shelters available, all you can think of is, "Damn. I could lose a full pound if I went with the Whizzerama-2." That's why it's like saying to someone, "Don't look at the elephant behind you", since everyone immediately starts thinking of elephants; knowing there is lighter shelter will stay in your mind every step to Walasi-Yi ("Hmmm, I wonder if I should change"), then to Hot Springs ("Hmmm, I think I should change") and then, if not sooner, to Damascus/Mt Rogers Outfitters ("Whatcha got that's lighter????????? NOW!!!!!).

Seriously, weight is the first and dominant consideration. If you can be comfortable in the lightest there is, do it.

The Weasel

[SGT Rock]

Originally posted by The Weasel
Tent weight, especially, is the worst issue of all, I think. It's usually the single heaviest item in your pack, and even sharing it with a partner, once you know there are lighter shelters available, all you can think of is, "Damn. I could lose a full pound if I went with the Whizzerama-2."

I tried one of those Whizzerama-2 shelters. It was still too heavy

My general advice is look for some shelter with a shared weight of 2 pounds or less per person. This should include stakes, poles, nets, flys, groundcloths, etc.

[MedicineMan]

while you are shopping for a tent (and if you have the dough) check out Hilleberg...it is the closest stuff to Stephenson's Wamlite tents out there and significantly cheaper....I am in lust with the Akto since I solo most of the time-though the girlfriend is starting to day hike with me (keep fingers crossed)...I own the Hilleberg BivAnorak and carry it on every day hike just in case (a neat concept of something you can wear and/or sleep in, the Swiss issue it to their fighter pilots) so I know their manuf. process is excellent..
I have been through the gamut of getting the lightest weight tent (have a collection of heavy to light) all the way to tarping which I dont mind at all...I also have the silnyl tube tent Moonbowgear made for me (which virtues I have toughted on this forum before) and the tube tent is the shelter I take when their is a possibility of not getting to use the shelter system on the AT for whatever reason, but when winter hiking and facing the possibility of really crappy weather it is the Hilleberg Akto for me....too many good things about this tent, true 4 season capability in 2lb 12 oz stock issue (lower by 3 ounces with a carbon fiber pole), good room for one, vestibule to cook in AND keep gear, but room inside for you and some gear....Hilleberg def. deserves consideration.

[chief]

i've found the first tent you mention, the clip flashlight, is an excellent tent for a long distance hike, however, for a couple, i'd go with the clip 3. should be plenty of room for a couple and gear. save the vestibule for stinky boots! i know it's trendy these days to go as light as possible, but i don't agree that weight is the most important consideration when selecting a tent or any other gear for that matter. given that trend, i fully expect to see many hikers adding weight in 2003, rather than the other way around. personally, i'm going with my clip and as in 2000, i'll be warm, dry, bug free and never once worry about the weight.

[Don]

I'll second the advice to have a look at the Clip Flashlight CD-3, particualry if you are hiking with a partner...The Clip 3 weighs in about 4libs 13 ouces according to Sierra's website while the Clip flashlight comes in about 3lbs 13oz. The Clip 3 has 44 square feet of floor space compared to 32 for the Flashlight...My wife and I were a pretty snug fit in the Flashlight and felt it would be too uncomfortable so we got the 3...At less than five pounds the CLip 3 compares favorably with many two person backpacking tents while giving you considerably more room..Its not a superlight tent by any means but it is a good tradeoff between weight, room, and snugness...

my $.02 worth...

[chris]

I would always consider most manufacturer's claim of weight to be optimistic at best. Most of the numbers do not correspond to any sort of reality. For example, the Walrus Arch Rival that I have (alot like the Clip 2) had (no more Walrus) a claimed weight of around 4 lbs. Packed up, it weighs more like 6 (actually 6 and change by my scale). Of course, this includes a full (i.e, storm rigging amount) of stakes, ground cloth, tie outs (for tying off the tent when you can't drive stakes), guy lines, and stuff sacks. I might be able to get the weight down to 4.5 lbs if I didn't bring stuff sacks, brought the minimum number of stakes (8-10), no guy lines or tie outs, and no ground cloth. I'm guessing that someone on this list has both a Clip Flashlite and a scale. Can anyone post actual numbers for the tent?

As a further example, the Marmot Arroyo (Long) was originally advertised as weighing 1 lb, 14 oz. In reality, it weighs 2 lbs, 9 oz. Marmot did restuff the bag for me, so they may have added more down than usual. They have, I believe, changed their weight claim for the Arroyo to 2 lbs after remodelling it.

There are only a few manufacturers whose weight as claimed are actually weights as delivered. Western Mountaineering and Bibler are two who spring to mind. It seems that claimed weight is treated alot like temperature ratings for sleeping bags: Claims don't mean a whole lot in reality.

[MOWGLI]

Originally posted by chris
For example, the Walrus Arch Rival... a claimed weight of around 4 lbs. Packed up, it weighs more like 6 (actually 6 and change by my scale).... I might be able to get the weight down to 4.5 lbs if I didn't bring stuff sacks, brought the minimum number of stakes (8-10), no guy lines or tie outs, and no ground cloth...

After a good nights rain, you can add another pound to that calculation.

FYI, I have never weighed my Clip Flashlight, and don't have a scale sensitive enough to do so, but... I tossed my groundcloth in Damascus and finished the AT without one. Yeah, my tent got dirty now & again, but I was careful where I pitched it to ensure that I didn't puncture the floor.

If you hike with a Clip Flashlight, consider saving some $$ and a few ounces by not purchasing a groundcloth. It really is not necessary.

[Jumpstart]

We got our arch rival down to 4 lbs, 10 oz (not unreasonable for two people) by replacing the stakes with titanium ones (took 6), replacing the stuff sacks with Equinox sil-nylon sacks, and we didn't use or need a groundcloth.

[chris]

How were you able to pitch an Arch Rival with only 6 stakes? The body alone seems to need 7. The fly then adds at least 3 more. To make the vestibule taught and the fly rigid, I need to add another 4 stakes. Just wondering what you did or did not stake down. The regular stakes weigh about .5 oz
per stake. So, if I can get away with taking 6 stakes rather than 14, I certainly will!

[Jumpstart]

Hi Chris,

2 in the front, 2 in the back, 2 for the vestibule of the fly. The rest of the fly clips to the tent. Stake it out tightly and we never had a problem. 14 stakes? Are you sure you have the Arch Rival?

you can see pics of the tent all staked out a variety of surfaces on our web page (bakerat.homeip.net)

[chris]

I have 3 stakes in the back, 4 up front for the
body. Graphically, the body would be staked as:
I'm a little weak on ascii art, so this isn't as
symmetrical as it could be.

+ +

+ +



+ +

+

Where the front is up. The fly velcros onto the
body at pole points and then is clipped via
4 clips into the main body stake points. Two more
stakes secure the vestibule in front and one more
pulls out the fly in the rear. So, the minimum
I can really bring is 10 stakes. However, to get
the vestibule taught, there are loops at the midway points along each side of the vestibule and I stake these out. To keep the fly completely off
the body and taught, so that it doesn't blow around in a heavy storm, I use the loops at the midway point on the fly to pull it out. So, storm rigging adds another 4 stakes. If I'm expecting a storm, I'll also guy out the tent from the poles.
I usually do this with rocks or locks, though.

What gallery are the pics in?

[stumpknocker]

Hi,
Try this web site and check out the 2-4-2 at www.wanderlustgear.com
I saw a lot of people using this tent as partners and they were very happy with it. I have the Nomad-Lite and love it.
There is a phone number in the web site so you can call Kurt Russell and ask him all your questions.Good luck in your search.

I don't think he's in business anymore. That's too bad because I would like to have some warranty work done on the tent I bought from him in 2001.

It's almost thread-bare. Doesn't seem to have held up as well as I hoped it would.

[skinewmexico]

REI Quarterdome T3 IS around 4-1/2# with decent stakes and no stuff sacks, and very spacious for 2.

[finskie]

I just gotta throw this out there... why not a hammock? If you want to go lite and cheap the Warbonnet Traveler is $60 and about 1lb., plus bugnet for $60 at 7.5oz (http://warbonnetoutdoors.com/travelers.php)... or if hammocks are generally uncomfortable for you, you can try a bridge hammock like the Jacks-r-better Bear Mountain Bridge. It's heavier at about 3lbs, but will lay flat( http://www.jacksrbetter.com/BMBH.htm ) For more info visit www.hammockforums.net. Sorry no help on the tent situation. The only one I use is a 6 person when I take the whole family out.