Just can't go there

[Bear Cables]

Okay, I've tried to consider ulta light weight or even light weight hiking but just can't "go there". I have decided to be happy with a sub 30 lb fully loaded for 6 days pack weight. Before food, water and fuel my pack weight is 18 lbs.There are some items I just don't want to leave behind. I dont' want to drink and eat from the same pot. I don't want to use the same bandana for personal cleaning and everthing else. I don't want to give up my pillow. Tried the stuff sack of clothes on one trip and couldn't ever get comfortable. I want the one change of clothes for mid hike. And I don't like alcohol stoves. And I just can't justify spending another 100.00 to get just one lb lighter.There! Said it and feel better.

[IsNotAHome]

If you can actually hike with a only a back pack full of gear then your already ahead of most people. If you think you've found your perfect place of weight vs. comfort then your ahead of most hikers, even UL's.

[Hikes in Rain]

Well, sub-30 loaded for six days, 18 before adding consumables, is pretty darned good, in my never to be humble opinion. Even with some untried new equipment, I doubt if I'm there. (But then, I still need to update my old Kelty external frame)

I agree with you, there are just some things I will not give up. They make me feel more comfortable, more civilized, and just generally add to my enjoyment of what's supposed to be a vacation, after all. To quote Nessmuk: "We go to the woods not to rough it, but to smooth it."

[Pagandaddy]

30 lbs is not a bad weight considering you will be shedding weight everyday by eating.

I have yet to upgrade my external frame also. But I have taken the original bag off and replaced it with a mesh bag saving a couple of pounds. Not having a pack against my back and soaked with sweat after hiking in the muggy South all day is worth a pound in pack weight.

[Just Jeff]

18 lbs is lightweight, if you ask me. Not ultralight or anything, but who cares?

I can barely tell the difference between 15 lbs and 25 lbs on my back, so why bother leaving the amenities behind? I usually have a luxury or two in my pack.

[safn1949]

I went out recently after not hiking for almost 15 years and learned a big lesson.I'm not 30 anymore,man what I carried at 30 is heavy as hell now at 54,whew.

So I have changed packs,sleeping bags,tent and cut down on the amount of food I carried.I like my comfort but I got rid of about 15 lbs.Man what a difference.I haven't weighed my new pack and gear yet as I am waiting for the sleeping bag but my guess is I went from 26 lbs minus food to about 19-20 lbs.I need to work on the food weight.

I found that out on the trail some of my menu was simply too heavy and too much food.I would like to keep the whole thing at less the 30 lbs with 4 days of food.

Pack 6 lbs down to 3.5 lbs
Sleeping bag 3 lbs down to 1.5 lbs
Cooking gear 15.9 oz down to 6 oz (just the pot and lid)
Tent 4 lbs 7 oz down to 2 lbs 6 oz

[garlic08]

...And I just can't justify spending another 100.00 to get just one lb lighter...

Where does this $100 per pound number come from? I've heard it before here in AT World and don't understand it. The exception, of course, is the sleeping bag, but only if one is forced to pay full retail.

I've spent about $800 for my gear which happens to weigh about eight pounds, but if I got a heavier pack, pad, and tent it would cost quite a bit more. My pack cost $80, tent $200, pad $20. I got real lucky and got my $360 sleeping bag for $180. My stove, when I carry one, was free. When I don't carry one, it's even freer--no need to buy fuel.

Just because I like to hike with an eight pound load doesn't mean anyone else should. I'm glad you found your happy weight. There are some I see with 5 pound loads which I know I'll likely never do and that's OK too.

[stranger]

18 lbs base weight is better than most people. It's all about what makes you comfortable in the woods, it's not all about weight.

I've always loved how many (not all) ultralighters will brag about their 12 ounce tarp, then watch the great lengths they go to to avoid ever sleeping under it, very amusing indeed. Like they will die if they don't get shelter space or something haha. Or they go..."but it's gonna rain", like that's the first time the thought came into their mind!

I ended up going fairly light but it had nothing to do with a desire to go light, it came with experience, and finding what I liked versus what I didn't like. I have good gear, but there is certainly better out there, and if I spent more time at camp I might carry more than I do. I got rid of stuff I didn't use, and I lightened up what I could, within reason.

Going light isn't about having the lightest 40 items, it's about only carrying 15-20 items, but if you find you need to carry 50 items to be happy, well you need to carry those 50 items then.

Low 30's all up is a fine weight, and it sounds like you know what you are doing, and know what you need, so no worries!

[Bear Cables]

I went out recently after not hiking for almost 15 years and learned a big lesson.I'm not 30 anymore,man what I carried at 30 is heavy as hell now at 54,whew.

So I have changed packs,sleeping bags,tent and cut down on the amount of food I carried.I like my comfort but I got rid of about 15 lbs.Man what a difference.I haven't weighed my new pack and gear yet as I am waiting for the sleeping bag but my guess is I went from 26 lbs minus food to about 19-20 lbs.I need to work on the food weight.

I found that out on the trail some of my menu was simply too heavy and too much food.I would like to keep the whole thing at less the 30 lbs with 4 days of food.

Pack 6 lbs down to 3.5 lbs
Sleeping bag 3 lbs down to 1.5 lbs
Cooking gear 15.9 oz down to 6 oz (just the pot and lid)
Tent 4 lbs 7 oz down to 2 lbs 6 oz

I totally agree about the difference between 30 and 54. I started hiking at 40 with 48 lbs.I am now pushing 56 but with the new gear available now it's easier to drop the weight of the Big 3.
My tent wt went from 8 lb Eureka to a 3 lb spitfire to a 27 oz Contrail
Bag went from a 3 lbs synthetic to a 22 oz down and Pack from a huge Kelty at about 5 lbs to a Golite Quest at 2lb14 oz.

[Bear Cables]

[QUOTE=garlic08;1012858]Where does this $100 per pound number come from? I've heard it before here in AT World and don't understand it. The exception, of course, is the sleeping bag, but only if one is forced to pay full retail./QUOTE]

I got that amount after identifying a few items that could be purchase in a lighter weight version. For example a plastic type sharp knife at .7 oz instead of my 1.5 oz one, a lighter bear line system, a lighter LED clip on light. just to name a few. Then there's the whole " Do I really want to spend 299.00 on a 5oz cuben fiber tarp?
So my 100.0 per 1lb was based on replacing certain items specific to my gear.

[safn1949]

I was just so used to carrying 40+ lbs (not knowing any better) that when I tried to do that a month ago (at 54) I almost killed myself.Holy cow,did I ditch some weight and fast.

As it is I injured my right knee and had to call it a day.Lesson learned,who said the old dog can't learn a new trick.

[JAK]

Adapt as you go.

[Dogwood]

I also agree with Garlic08. Maybe, for you and your situation you equate going lighter with $100/lb but that does not mean it has to be the case in general. Yes, sometimes replacing certain items of your hiking kit, or certainly regearing your whole kit, with the absolute lightest wt gear requires departing with some extra do re mi. But, it does not always have to be that way.

You gave some good examples of going lighter and not having to break the bank when you switched out shelters - from the 8 lb Eureka(?) to the 3 lb Spitfire to the 27 oz Contrail. A Henry Shires Contrail Tarptent can be had for $200 or even less if you shop around or buy used which I ocassionaly see for sale. A Contrail is very cost competive to other conventionally weighted and priced shelters. You did the same with your pack. You went from a much heavier Kelty to a lighter GoLite Quest and I bet the GoLite Quest cost about the same, maybe even less than the Kelty.

I'll give you some more examples. My current goto thru-hiking pack is the ULA Conduit with all the features I desire, weighs 22 oz., and costs a whopping $125. I could easily have spent twice that for a similiar volumed pack that weighed twice as much. You also mention Cuben fiber tarps. My goto thru-hiking shelters are typically a Spinnaker or Cuben fiber tarp. I realize tarps are not for everyone. There are sometimes issues that have to be worked out when using a tarp in certain condtions. But, even though both my Spinnaker and Cuben fiber tarps are custom sized, which I paid extra for, I still didn't spend more than $225 for either one of them. If you were really interested in a Cuben fiber tarp, and again you have to consider if a tarp or a tarp made from Cuben fiber is right for you and your hike(s), I think if you shop around you will find you can purchase Cuben fiber tarps for much less than the $299 you claim you need to spend for a Cuben fiber tarp. I know Mountain Laurel Designs, ZPacks, and Oware, among others, manufacture Cuben fiber tarps under $200.

Consider also, that those transitioning to lighter wt. or UL gear, don't usually do it all at once. You can purchase this kind of gear as your knowledge of what you want and what's available grows, as I suspect you did when you transitioned to lighter wt shelters. Perhaps, the Contrail suits you fine and that's as low wt as you wish to go. Great! You don't need the latest greatest lightest wt gear to backpack and don't let anyone look down on you who tells you otherwise!

And, it's not just light wt gear that can carry a high price tag sometimes it's just more technical gear, or the newest hottest gear, or gear with more features(which also tends to be heavier) that can put a pinch on hiking gear budgets. And, if you have any doubts that UL, or at least lighter wt gear, can be purchased at deep discounts or home built at an actual lower price than most conventional weighted gear you should read some of Sgt Rock's suggestions in some of his articles here on WB. Going UL with your whole kit, or just specific pieces, DOES NOT necessarily mean having to go Ultra expensive!

OK Great. I'm glad we all feel better. Now, let's go out and backpack which is what backpacking is really all about.

[sbhikes]

I started the PCT with about 22lbs. As I went along, there were a lot of things I did not need after all. So I sent them home. I figured out after a while that long distance hiking is different than the kind where you enjoy the camping more. You don't need as much stuff when long-distance hiking. It's sort of counter-intuitive, but that's how it appears to work for lots of people. Eventually I also replaced a few things -- yes, during the hike. I bought a different pack (actually a heavier one) and sleeping bag. Yay Internet! I probably got down to 18 pounds or so.

Then I spent the winter between my hikes getting rid of even more weight. I bought an $80 pack (and then a $40 one -- funny how sometimes lighter is cheaper). I went through several Red Bull and V-8 cans until I made a stove that would work. I ruined a couple of disposable cookie sheets. I bought several thrift store items before settling on the clothing I liked. I dumpster dived and collected junk I found walking the neighborhood. I dropped a bowling ball's worth of weight with my super cheap efforts. I felt proud of my hiker trash/dirtbagger/bag lady gear.

I posted my gear last weekend on BP Light. Most, but not all, of it is the same stuff I had on the PCT. Here is my gear.

I'm sure not everyone would be happy with so little and I know you can find fault with my stuff. I just wanted to show you can go light with hobo trash and it's not required to spend a lot of money. Once you get this light, you can add back the things that really make you happy. Such as a book. I wished I had had a book.

[Bear Cables]

Going UL with your whole kit, or just specific pieces, DOES NOT necessarily mean having to go Ultra expensive!

OK Great. I'm glad we all feel better. Now, let's go out and backpack which is what backpacking is really all about.

Good post! Good points and let's go hike!

[Bear Cables]

SBHikes, I saw your post on backpackinglight. Impressed but, again, not ready to go there. But still impressed.

[sbhikes]

You don't have to go there. 18lbs isn't a ton. But if you ever do want to go lighter, like if you want to do a hike where the goal is making a lot of distance in a short amount of time with a reliable and dry weather forecast, you can do it cheaply with hobo trash like I did.

[Fiddleback]

I think the true gram weenie may exist but I dunno. My definition of such is someone who, no matter what, continually works to reduce pack weight. That is, low(er) weight is paramount to all other considerations. I have never met anyone like that.

To me light/ultralight backpacking is about reducing pack weight without sacrificing safety or comfort. If reducing weight impacts either of those two considerations, then it is foolish in the first, and too extreme for me in the second.

As pointed out above, 'weight' is only one facet of comfort on the trail. One should carry what makes the trip fun, comfortable and safe. But by mixing and matching, adding here and cutting there, and paying attention to (appropriate) dual use, one can take a whole lotta weight off the back.

I use to carry a 30lb base weight...now it's about 15 (yet I pack for colder nights). Some of that reduction is due to new products, new technology, or old concepts and gear that I learned about and adopted. But the huge for me bottom line after cutting my pack weight in half...? I sleep more comfortably, hike more comfortably, and eat better than I ever did with the heavier pack.

Safety...comfort...enjoyment. Don't compromise the first...the rest is an individual decision of where to draw the line(s).

FB

[Bear Cables]

You don't have to go there. 18lbs isn't a ton. But if you ever do want to go lighter, like if you want to do a hike where the goal is making a lot of distance in a short amount of time with a reliable and dry weather forecast, you can do it cheaply with hobo trash like I did.

Your right about the forcast. Knowing what to expect can help add or eliminate a certain amount of gear. It's the uncertianty of it that makes me carry more gear than really might or might not need.

[East Coast Alex]

To me light/ultralight backpacking is about reducing pack weight without sacrificing safety ...

I have a random sort of "gram weenie" verus "safety" question that requires some honesty, regarding whether any of you guys routinely leave the compass home, because you've found that you really don't need it on a marked trail?

Seems people might be loathe to admit that they would do that, as it is often drilled into people heads that you simply "need," a compass, or else you are supposedly the worlds biggest dumb-ass for not having one... or so the survival experts like to say...... but anyway, just thought I'd ask.


I usually tote it along anyway, but I feel it is more out of an obligatory nature than actually needing it. Oftentimes I get the feeling that it's just a useless piece of crap that is sucking up vital room in my pack that otherwise could be a slot filled by something more useful.

It's not the compass is heavy, or takes up much space... as its probably one of the lightest and most compact things in any persons pack.... but on a well marked trail.... I often feel like I just don't need it.


Quite frankly, I'd rather have a GPS, weighing my options between the two. I'm especially not pleased about having to tote around that thing either, as a GPS is considerably larger and moreover substantially heavier... but all in all..... I seem to find it more useful, as it pegs my exact spot on a trail map.. and that's all I really want to know. A compass doesn't really do that for me.