So what 'do' you do about it.Originally Posted by Lone Wolf
Yea I think I know who you mean, well all these ideas for future trail days are only words and you know what they say about words.., "it's dialog and that's a start"
Had an intoxicated male about 30 years old walk into camp, sat down in one of the camp chairs and began to hit on my son-in-laws sister. He was friendly at the time, not obnoxious and carried on conversation with us all. He was from Abingdon. He then sat his cup of beer (which he had brought with him) in the cup holder on the chair and passed out. He was not a problem at this point so we let him sleep. About 2 hours later a few of our clan returned to camp and the gentleman who owned the chair that the man was sitting in wanted to sit down. I attempted to awake him 3 or 4 times and finally he opened his eyes and looked at me. I looked him square in the face and politely stated that he needed to move because the owner of the chair had returned. He said no. I informed him that I was going to summon the police and he just laughed and closed his eyes again. I tapped him on his knee and asked him again to get up. He sat forward, threw his cup if beer on me, sat back in the chair, crossed his arms and said "make me". I told him to get out of my camp and again he refused. I have always been a non-violent person but with the beer toss, I lost my temper. I stood up, tipped the chair over backward and my son-in-law put him in a head lock on the ground and told him to calm down or he was going to be hurt. He said OK and was released and got to his feet. A fellow hiker walking past and seeing the incident asked if we had a problem and I said yes. He calmly and professionaly put the intoxicated man in an arm lock behind his back and escorted the man to the bingo hall parking lot and released him there. There was no further incident.
geek
Local...thank you again for a fantastic weekend. Your planning and hard work showed.
Wolf, Trix, et al...I agree with the heightened security/wristband ideas for next year. As this has only been my third Trail Days I can't really compare this year's experience with that of old. But, I did have a great time and thought that it was nicer for most folks to be camped in the woods (though this did mean that my prime real estate was taken up by the usual field crowd).
That said, I'd like to see ALL hiker services and gear reps in the town park. It's a charming idea to have tent city be a one-stop (with the addition of Jeremiah opening up across the street with beer) for hikers but I think that folks should be pressured to go downtown and "give back" to their hosts.
Also, I think it should be mandatory that all underage campers (locals and thru-hikers) set up in the no-alcohol section. I'm not sure how this would be policed or managed but at least you wouldn't have the packs of underagers car camping and getting wasted in the woods.
I'd also like to see the camps police themselves a bit more. In 2009 the drum circle'rs found their way into our camp and I had no problem telling the LEO's where we were or that there were a number of folks in our camp that we didn't know. I can vouch that the only people that were made aware of the police presence in our camp were those not intended to be there in the first place (i.e. the 17-year-olds raiding our coolers).
I worked as a movie theater projectionist. During the afternoon we'd sell senior citizen discounted matinée tickets by the dozens. Bruce Willis was jumping through plate glass windows and thousands of seniors spent countless hours not having heart attacks.
I was sure that by adding up the total amount of time that seniors spent watching action movies it would equal at least one lifetime. But still, no one died.
It's a tragic way of looking at things but to think in those terms it is not surprising that crime and injury happens at Trail Days but that we don't see MORE of it. I think this says a lot about the amount of planning and attention the event receives and how conscientious most of the intended attendees are.
i've suggested a similar idea before in previous td threads but i'd like to expand my idea on wrist bands
one color for those camping and over 21
one color for those camping and under 21
one color for those just visiting and over 21
one color for those just visiting and under 21
that way everyone can quickly identify those are 'just visiting' and yes i think it should be charged for... i don't think its a crazy idea.... the town is going out of its way to let 2000-ish people camp in the woods, charging could pay for the extra emergency personal and porta johns and what not... i do however hope it stays at a lower price/price for the weekend type thing
Gaiter
homepage.mac.com/thickredhair
web.mac.com/thickredhair/AT_Fall_07
Every racetrack I've ever been too (and I've been to most all of them in the south) have an alcohol free section. I think its a great idea. Still, if my kids are with me, we will be spending the days in town and the nights camping at one of the numerous campgrounds within half an hour of town.
You gotta get that shower at the right time. There is no way the water heater can keep up with that demand.
A Rinnai Tankless Water Heater is probably out of the question...........
Fear ridges that are depicted as flat lines on a profile map.
i had these ideas long before discussions with you or anyone elseI see you were paying attention during our coffee
nope. one color, one price for 21+. the same for under 21.
disagree
you are completely misrepresenting the facts here, morpheus. the individual that arranged for the band told the Poice Chief that he had spoken to the fire chief and the town mayor ( and had not) before getting the ok to even have the band play (which had never been done before). also the police did NOT come riding up in the car to the sight of the band behind the bingo building. the band was allowed to play until midnight on fri, more than one set, and did not play on sat at all. the band was very polite and courteous when asked to shut down, since it was in somewhat of a residential area (maybe you don't care about the local residents, but I do). The sheriffs dept had nothing to do with telling the band to shut down, I did, the local police. and what you are refering to with the car and lights was over at the general store after they had finished with the BLUEGRASS music that is played every sat night, when the proprietor (fancy word for owner) turned on the song "bad boys" with the door wide open, as a joke, at 1130pm, after he had officially closed on sat. I do agree with the major prob being some of the local youth, but, if you think you can just ignore the laws because you are a hiker, and don't have to live in town and answer to the residents of the town, then don't come back, you won't be missed. Maybe you should be a little more free with the truth about what happened and not so free with the name calling and insults. To the majority of the hikers that participated in this years TD, we look forward to next year, because for the most part you were all very polite and respectful, of myself and the people who live in Damascus.
Thanks to the obnoxious Sherriff's department presence at Traildays the last two years, I've decided this is my last visit until tent city lands on private property.
I saw multiple arrests for public intoxication and simple marijuana possession (a roach) to harmless individuals just having a good time. Friday night there was a great free jam band that got shut down after only playing one set. While the band was playing Johnny Law pulls a cruiser right up to the crowd and turns the headlights on the crowd so they can get a better look at who's doing what.
The local youth is the real problem. They come through at night trying to freeload beer and get threatening when you don't hand it over because they wouldn't show ID's. I don't need "contributing to a minor" on my resume. Sorry.
For those of you that aren't bothered, I salute your ability to look the other way, but I get incensed over hovering fascists.
You are welcome and you are welcome, to return. we appreciate the fact that people come to have a good time, but, there are still laws to be enforced. I don't ever want to be any more strict, or lenient, on an individual just because they are a hiker. as with anything some are great folks, some are not, just like the local citizenry. enjoy your hike.
i showed shortly after 11:00 PM and noticed the car too. it was the fire chief and an associate in a Damascus Volunteer Fire Dept. vehicle. kinda looked like a PD vehicle
since the author of this thread has stated he won't be back, who cares what he thinks?
Dyslexics Untie!
I really had a great time, and had no problem with the law coming in and doing their job. People need to think about the risks involved before they act, and it usually is the last person that gets caught instead and that is jsut life.
Hey, I've got a novel idea......
Obey the laws and you don't have to worry about going to jail!!!
As much of a hassle it would be for LEOs, the only way to curb illegal activity is to arrest all offenders. Usually, LEOs use discretion to determine if an offense is something that needs to be formally addressed. Sometimes a good scare is enough. However, I don't think any of the proposed ideas would be all that effective. Kids have been getting around wristbands for decades. And any other form of "tagging", for that matter.
My suggestion is this. Arrest the offenders, and give them a choice: they could come back to Damascus 14 days from the offense to perform community service or they could let the case enter the court system. I would guess most would choose the first, but it would be painful to a thruhiker who has hiked north.
Either way, the strong arm of the law is the only way you are gonna get folks to stop breaking it. I offer this only because it seems that letting minor illegal activity slide and kept under control is not an option. I have seen that approach done both successfully and unsuccessfully, so no judgment, but it is clear that Damascus is not open to a controlled party zone. In my mind, the only option then is to arrest all offenders. This will be the only deterrent. Especially when the "crime" is something the guy next to you is doing legally.
Ah, the good 'ol days by the crick. (of course, don't think any of the townspeople kept up by us partying long for those days).
Yahtzee
ANy clue why the band on Saturday night IN A RESIDENTIAL area right next to the rock school had a band playing louder the band at eh Gazebo till 2 am??????
That sucked, as I was exhausted, decided to sleep on saturday, returned to the house AWOL was renting by 11:30 only to have to hear SCREAMING music till 2 am....they didnt get shut down at all. Why???
Oh, and heres an Idea for the 'local' traffic.
Have a bright ORANGE wrist band and charge them $15 (Or 5-10 more then hikers) to walk in.
Check their IDs, if it isnt obvious they are local or semi local and not at all hikers, this will deter them and also give a heads up to hikers who is not a hiker at all.
sure I know there are cool people who dont hike who just enjoy it, but this may help overall.
Also, I want to point out it was nice that the police presence was smaller and less invasive then in previous years.
define invasive. if you have something to hide like open containers weed or moonshine then you might think their presence is invasive
Exactly.
I live near the GSMNP - we have many, many festivals in this area and I attend several. The LEOs here and the LEOs in Damascus use somewhat the same approach -- exercise a bit of leniency unless the behavior is causing a problem or dangerous. I've seen LEOs fail to note pot smoking, suspicious containers and brief nudity (campers changing clothes) at festivals here and in Damascus.... they aren't out to stop people from having a good time, but to stop situations from getting outta control to disturb others and / or dangerous.
While I know many in the 18 to 21 crowd don't like the enforcement of underage drinking laws, Damascus has already experienced a near-fatality with this. They have ample reason to ban it as a dangerous behavior - especially when a substance as potent as moonshine (illegal PGA) is involved. Kids with no little to no prior experience with this potent substance can very easily drink enough to do themselves in before the effects start.....
While I know it would likely not be PC for Damascus to say this out loud, I would hope that the no-booze camping would also be a no-drug zone among the campers. Some of us have been having a wonderful time without drugs or alcohol for decades and others never used those items as part of their fun.
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