Are fewer Americans visiting national parks?

[Carl in FL]

BTW, I'm sorry that I interpreted your statement that one possible solution was to "turn it over to private enterprise and let them charge admission" meant that you saw that as a possible solution.

I do see it as one possible solution, but not one I would support.
I support things like the NOC and the "white water" rafting there,
which I partook of a few years back, but not butt ugly things like
the Grand Canyon Skyway, which I have not and will not support.

No, I support the Federal Government protecting the naturalness
of our National Forests, to the greatest extent possible whilst still
allowing us to see and appreciate that beauty. It is at times a very
difficult task to achieve that delicate balance, and this is why I
have mixed feelings on the duality of tax-payer and user-supported
fees.

[Alligator]

Please keep the thread focused on National Parks and not wandering off into broader politics. Thanks.

[Wise Old Owl]

What part of the economy did Future walker miss? This is clear politics, The last two years has tremendously devalued the dollar - with tarp & and subsequent programs. AT the beginning of March a personal trip to the Grand Carmen, A British Island..... I discovered that gas was $7 a gallon after the conversion and a dinner was $50 US I am neither democrat or republican, but to the Germans - they love to hike, and now the AT is a cheap trip! Japan & China hold our marker, I just got back from a photo shoot in Dupont's Longwood Gardens, at $18 dollars a ticket. I felt I was only white person there. Winterthur is out of my price range... (the other Dupont Park)

Folks you need to wake up there will be a turnstile on the AT to charge for the trip in your lifetime...

After posting I saw Alligators post and I agree, and please understand I am trying..... Just wake up folks!

[WingedMonkey]

Well then, I'm just gonna stop going to the woods if you are the "only white person" there.

[Wise Old Owl]

Longwood is a large Dupont Estate, a house on some 250+acres that is covered in gardens, waterfalls, conservatories, and a mansion in the middle.... Yesterday, I got on the estate for a photoshoot with a Groupon discount ticket of $9 and most of the people were talking in Japanese, German, Indian, and Chinese' My comment about being the "only white guy there" was inappropriate - but few were talking English.


In all my years of visits to the place - it was a clear difference about who can afford to go there.

[WingedMonkey]

Longwood is a large Dupont Estate, a house on some 250+acres that is covered in gardens, waterfalls, conservatories, and a mansion in the middle.... Yesterday, I got on the estate for a photoshoot with a Groupon discount ticket of $9 and most of the people were talking in Japanese, German, Indian, and Chinese' My comment about being the "only white guy there" was inappropriate - but few were talking English.


In all my years of visits to the place - it was a clear difference about who can afford to go there.

While certainly not a National Park, I would imagine like the parks it relies on and markets to foreign tourists. Longwood goes out of the way to offer their webpage and ticket sales in Chinese, French, Japanese, Korean, Russian and Spanish. I have no problem taking money form any foreign visitors if it keeps a park or historical attraction running.

[futureatwalker]

So I did so.

This URL
http://www.nature.nps.gov/stats/
is the place to start.

Could international visitation have gone from 1% of the total to even 20% of the total in twelve years, with no noticeable increase in total visitation?
I suppose it's POSSIBLE, but simple facts make it difficult to support that conclusion.

It seems you're taking one VERY limited observation by an admittedly biased observer, and turning it into a national statistical trend.
Facts are usually a better way to approach a question.

Thanks for the link. I suppose I was generalising, but check out Bryce for yourself, and let me know what you think. There was no way that the % of people from outside the U.S. that I encountered was 1% of the total, but I'll concede the possibility that my experience was a statistical fluke (over 5-days). Also, I was camping, and not staying in the lodge. My suspicion, however, is that Bryce is perhaps more of a popular destination for overseas folk (who take it in, with the Grand Canyon), as opposed to some of the eastern U.S. parks and monuments.


What follows is suggestive only:

	U.S. population	National Park Visits
1980	226,542,199	220,463,211
1990	248,709,873	255,581,467
2000	281,421,906	285,891,275
2010	307,745,538	281,303,769

The population data is from the census (I presume: http://geography.about.com/od/obtain...ta/a/uspop.htm) and from the National Park Visit website.

Broadly, the U.S. population continues to increase, while visits to the National Parks, as Golden Bear correctly notes, have stayed within a limited range from 1986-2010.

On a different note: I was happy to pay the $25 charge to get in for the week. I consider it a donation for something I wish to see preserved. (And the ranger-led programs were great for children.)

[Ron Haven]

they are fewer people traveling period because of fuel prices.

[DapperD]

Gas is $4 a gallon and unemployment is at 10%. Fears about the economy getting worse are strong enough to keep a lot of people close to home on any vacation and saving their money.

I agree with you on this. Unless one has a good job or any job at all, most just don't have the money to splurge on long road trips right now.

[Sly]

they are fewer people traveling period because of fuel prices.

If you get 20 mpg it adds about $50 for every 1000 miles of travel over a year ago. That's really not too much. I think it's more psychological than anything else.

[modiyooch]

I just got back, and I think there were plenty of people. too many for my taste. no parking. no vacancies.

[Carl in FL]

If you get 20 mpg it adds about $50 for every 1000 miles of travel over a year ago. That's really not too much. I think it's more psychological than anything else.

Ron Haven is correct but it is irrelevant. While some people will defer travel,
there are still so many people with the funds to do so, the parks get full.

When the cruise industry instituted the fuel surcharge (like $8 to $12 per
person per day) I thought it was going to affect occupancy rates. Wrong.
They were at 100%, they still are at 100%. There's enough folks with enough
disposable income to fill all the beds.

Sly is also correct; if you are committed to seeing the Grand Canyon this year,
another hundred dollars or so isn't going to defeat you. Losing your job will.

[Blissful]

I don't know but there was a TON of visitors at Yellowstone from all over the nation. The lots were overflowing and people everywhere. All the campgrounds were jammed.
But no one in the backcountry (though that may have been b/c of the bear attack a week before we arrived).

There was not that many at Mesa Verde, really. At Great Sand Dunes we had the trails to ourselves. Rushmore was packed. No one at Devil Tower or at Wind Cave.

We put all our money toward gas.

[Mags]

More than national park visitation, a trend has been noted that *backcountry* use is declining. Amount of day use vs overnight in parks, USFS, etc. is a bit down vs the past.

http://www.nsga.org/files/public/Ten...web_100521.pdf

http://www.nsga.org/files/public/201...Web_100521.pdf

Or 15.3 million participants in 1999 vs 11.1 million people in 2010. This particular report was by the National Sporting Good Assoc who make moolah of what people actually do.

Other reports have similar results.. Anecdotal evidence off a 'gut check' seems to show this too (go in five miles at a popular local trailhead..and there is no one! )

[Pringles]

A few years ago I visited Death Valley in May. I asked a question and the ranger looked at me like I had three heads and said, "You speak English." Umm, yeah. I realize it's a different park, but it's in that region. The ranger explained that once summer hits, their tourists are almost all foreign. Folks from the U.S. avoided the area because they knew it was going to be very, very hot. I have no notion if that happens at Bryce or Zion, but it might have a similar impact. Pringles

[DapperD]

I don't know but there was a TON of visitors at Yellowstone from all over the nation. The lots were overflowing and people everywhere. All the campgrounds were jammed.

I'll bet Yellowstone is probably always packed.

[Feral Nature]

Perhaps the problem is the increasing obesity in our country and computers. Too many people just cannot leave McDonalds or facebook.

[jbwood5]

We are all waiting until we can get our senior access lifetime pass. Then we'll use our vacation time to visit all the National Parks. The problem is... how do we afford to get there?

Seriously though, $25 entrance fee is a chunk of change when you combine it with travel.... especially when your take home pay is in the $550 range a week. By the time you pay rent, utilities, groceries, car repairs, etc., there is nothing left.

[Wise Old Owl]

Jbwoods! yea thats my answer... Since the movie of Chevy Chase's Vacation.... folks here have lost interest in seeing all 50 states... part of the Mcdonalds on every corner mentality... I can see the US on TV!

The manufacture of gas guzzling Hummers and Winnebago's is in the toilet.. Just like a boat, most fifth wheels are parked permanently like a southern house on wheels no matter where you are...

Leaders take responsibility, Losers point the blame at others....... Must be the economy......

[weary]

More than national park visitation, a trend has been noted that *backcountry* use is declining. Amount of day use vs overnight in parks, USFS, etc. is a bit down vs the past.

http://www.nsga.org/files/public/Ten...web_100521.pdf

http://www.nsga.org/files/public/201...Web_100521.pdf

Or 15.3 million participants in 1999 vs 11.1 million people in 2010. This particular report was by the National Sporting Good Assoc who make moolah of what people actually do.

Other reports have similar results.. Anecdotal evidence off a 'gut check' seems to show this too (go in five miles at a popular local trailhead..and there is no one! )

All true, but very sad. I've devoted most of my waking hours in recent years to encouraging people to enjoy the woods and hills.