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  1. #1
    Virginia Tortoise
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    Default Why have So Many New England Shelters Burned Down?

    Last month it was Ore Hill Shelter, NH. A few months before that it was Tucker-Johnson Shelter, VT. And a few years before that it was Lost Pond Shelter, VT (twice). Are these shelters being burned down on purpose? By accident? And are the perps hikers, hunters or just vandals?

  2. #2

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    I have no idea who may have done the deed, but it's probably pretty safe to state that if these shelters had been simple tent platforms it probably wouldn't have happened.

    Should they be replaced with new shelters? That's my question.
    As I live, declares the Lord God, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked turn back from his way and live. Ezekiel 33:11

  3. #3
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    Massholes.

  4. #4
    4eyedbuzzard's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mudhead View Post
    Massholes.
    Sometimes, but not always. We aren't immune to breeding a fair share of our own local retards. It's almost never serious hikers or outdoors people though, usually just idiots out for a one or two day drunk/drug party in the woods. Same type of people who go off hunting drunk, shoot at movement, etc. No sense of responsibility or respect.

  5. #5

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    What the heck would these motards do if they didn't have a "carport" rat box shelter to cluster around?? Probably find a dead-end turn-around and sit by their trucks.

  6. #6

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    Are these shelters being completely burned down? Any one got pics or a good description of the damage?

  7. #7
    Registered User Wise Old Owl's Avatar
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    Sort of why we don't have many covered bridges in Pennsylvania - from the 50's on its been drunken disillusioned teens finding fun in destruction.

    Not so hard to figure out... surprised you asked the question.
    Dogs are excellent judges of character, this fact goes a long way toward explaining why some people don't like being around them.

    Woo

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4eyedbuzzard View Post
    Sometimes, but not always. We aren't immune to breeding a fair share of our own local retards.
    You've met some of my kinfolk.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by john gault View Post
    Are these shelters being completely burned down? Any one got pics or a good description of the damage?
    AMC reported it being "destroyed"
    http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/forests/whit...in/conditions/

  10. #10

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    Lost Pond shelter may have been malicious.

    Frankly, if you think about all the scorch marks from stoves, and candles that are burnt down to puddles, it's amazing we don't loose more of them. For those of us who remember the Whisperlite days, you know every shelter has been the scene of at least one fireball from a newbie trying to light his stove for the first time.

    Cosmo

  11. #11

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    It's a sign,end of days,thee apocalypse,sun spots,El Nemo.................Fire Bug!

  12. #12

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    Get rid of 'em all!!!
    "Take another road to another place,disappear without a trace..." --Jimmy Buffet

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by restless View Post
    Get rid of 'em all!!!
    that would be awesome

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by mudhead View Post
    Massholes.
    Quote Originally Posted by 4eyedbuzzard View Post
    Sometimes, but not always. We aren't immune to breeding a fair share of our own local retards. .
    Sometimes but not always? Common sense says it's most likely locals. I guess that's something they don't instill up north.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by restless View Post
    Get rid of 'em all!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Wolf View Post
    that would be awesome
    Yeah and since most shelters are near water the sources the entire are around them would trashed into oblivion

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sly View Post
    Yeah and since most shelters are near water the sources the entire are around them would trashed into oblivion
    they already are hoss

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Wolf View Post
    they already are hoss
    Do you seriously think taking down the shelters would improve the area? If so you're not giving it much thought.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sly View Post
    Do you seriously think taking down the shelters would improve the area?
    yup. sure do

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by restless View Post
    Get rid of 'em all!!!
    My comment wasn't some off the wall comment by some know nothing hiker. Admittedly, there are people on here with more experience than I, but I feel that having worked and hiked on trails for the past 15 years has given me a fair amount of insight. In places, there are fewer problems with shelters than at others. Generally, these are located in areas that don't see as high a concentration of day and overnight use. But other areas are so severely impacted that it would take a generation or more for the land to recover from the abuse. The shelters in Georgia, the Smokies, Mt. Rogers NRA, the Whites and to a lesser extent the Shenadoahs all see a tremendous amount of use. Trash is left in the fire pits, discarded food and gear is left in the shelters, problem animals are more prevalent and diseases transmitted by rodents is much more likely. I don't lay all the blame on thru hikers, but they take some amount of responsibility. True, most of the trash is left by day users, weekend warriors and by those who may not even be hiking (i.e.-hunters, and locals who drive up and walk in). But I have seen long distance hikers and thru hikers leave burned trash in the fire rings and I know that they have brought up beer from town and left the cans there believing it to be the shelter caretakers responsibility to carry it out. With a few exceptions, this doesn't happen. The maintaining clubs are stretched thin with an aging core group of volunteers and most shelters are lucky to see a caretaker once a month.
    By removing the shelters, hikers will be forced to camp in dispersed areas. Rather than having upwards of 50 people camping at a shelter site, smaller groups would camp in more frequent but smaller sites. The chances of those sites being used repeatedly to the extent that the area around shelters are is minimal. Many backcountry surveys have been done and in most cases, it is proven to be better for the ecosystem if people are encouraged to use low impact, dispersed camping techniques. It won't eliminate in every situation the trash problem-that is another can of worms that is for another discussion-but it would prevent an area from becoming over impacted due to overuse. It might also to help reduce the number of hikers each year, thus the annual impact from thru hikers. One only need look at other discussions on this site questioning the need to carry a tent.
    Removing the shelters is only one of the problems. Until every hiker-day,overnight,section and thru, become familiar with Leave No Trace techniques and practices them as religiously as they do in decreasing their pack weight, the AT will continue to be impacted in certain areas. I venture to say that although we say we adhere to LNT principles, our practice falls way too short every time.
    Every place on the AT suffers from impact. Some impacts falls within expected and acceptable levels. Having a footpath through the woods will always create some sort of impact; the trailbed itself is a non natural feature. But there are areas on the AT that do suffer, and show extensive signs of overuse and the shelters and their surrounding environs are the primary culprit.

    Ok. I've had my say. Now, go ahead and rip me a new one if you so choose.
    "Take another road to another place,disappear without a trace..." --Jimmy Buffet

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by restless View Post

    Ok. I've had my say. Now, go ahead and rip me a new one if you so choose.
    oh he will even though you've done more maintaining and trail building by accident than he and i will ever do on purpose. georgia shelter areas are disgusting

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