"Live and let live"??? Child neglect is a criminal offense in most places. But sure, turn your head, mind your own business, blah blah blah.
"You're a nearsighted, bitter old fool."
you need to do the same. you're just as much a cyber hiker as the one's you accuseOriginally Posted by Sly
Gotta agree with Sly here.
Too many judgmental people coming down on this woman for trying an adventure that the kids will never forget.
Her biggest fault was probably creating the online journal that all the perfect people are condemning.
Luckily I had a father who was similar and let us go out and camp and hike pretty much whenever we wanted as 10-15 year old kids.
Sure taught me a lot.
Don't let your fears stand in the way of your dreams
i disagree with both of you. neither one of you has met or had any interaction with this family
Oh, ok - weird thing for herto say then --thanks
It's funny, but I know there are plenty of uneducated single parents who have kids running wild on city streets all hours of the day and night, doing all sorts of drugs, family violence, and so forth. This family just happens to be in "our realm" so we are making a big deal about them. If this were a site about the streets of the Chicago South side though, we might hold this woman up as a model parent.
I agree with you Papa D. The AT is far away from real life issues for most of the country.
Neglect is neglect, regardless of whether this happens in our AT community or in our neighborhood.
Some people take the straight and narrow. Others the road less traveled. I just cut through the woods.
Words of wisdom have been spoken. Knowledge=Power It MAY be needed here to protect the innocent. We try to do that in this country.
I'm glad we all don't turn our heads.
Right on!! And the ill treatment of children is all relative but it matters to THESE children. Thank God for our ability to feel empathy and compassion. I feel bad for people who can't feel those emotions, as much as they should. I'm not judging b/c it's never something anyone would not want to feel. Who would ever choose that? No one.
Sir, I criticize parents who let their kids roam the streets as well. And there's not a day when the sun would rise where I would hold this woman up as an average parent or adult much less a prized model one. This woman is a freeloader and a mighty sore parent in my book. To let a troubled O.D.D. Kid off on his own in the woods or an unfamiliar town is inviting trouble. Reading this woman's journal puts this into straight from the horses mouth so i have to kinda chuckle when several here are rewriting this mother's tale to make it out to be a heap better than what it is. Been reading White blaze for a couple years now too and recently decided to make it official and join. Never met Lone Wolf or TOW but reckon they are usually ones who say Mind Your own business here if I recall. Them jumping up after meeting this family makes up my mind if it werent made up after reading the journal. It's mighty easy to look the other way or pretend what is going on is right. Hope the good officer has notified other authorities up the trail to be on the lookout for more neglect.
It's what this country and society does with religious right-wingers and nut cases all the time.
In my opinion, that is a much more damaging, sad, and destructive way to bring up your kids than taking them out on a hike for which you may be unprepared and grossly underfunded. The woman is spending a lot of time with her kids, I see no report or indication of physical abuse. Some may claim mental abuse or neglect, that's a tough one to quantify, and on a continuum of what I have observed in everyday life, it does not strike me as alarming.
Yes, if the kids truly are mal-nourished, this may be an issue. But absent any actual evidence of such, I would be willing to give Mom the benefit of the doubt and assume that her comments about going without food for several days are tongue-in-cheek exaggeration.
Would I allow a nearly 13 year-old with Attention Deficit Disorder to hike on his own? Perhaps, perhaps not. Depends on the kid and the situation. Oft times the diagnosis of these conditions is by a family practitioner and not the most accurate. The boy has hiked over 500 miles with Mom and company, I would assume he has developed some skills and that Mom has developed some confidence in him and his skills.
Regarding the 15 year old who got separated and spent a night alone, we were all cheering a couple of years ago when a 16 year-old headed out for a thru-hike on his own, this kid is one year younger and spend one night on his own. I don't see the reasoning for the outcries of abuse. Again, this kid has already hiked on the trail for over 500 miles, I assume he has developed a fair number of skill to see him through.
OK, they shorted The Place some money. Are they the first to do this? Sounds like, from Mom's most recent post, that they did leave a substantial donation (more than most any other hiker and confirmed by LW), and that they did some chores and resupply of the commodities used. Not really free-loading in my book. If The Place feels they need to receive a set amount, then charge a set amount and quit calling it a "donation". Too confusing to those who just happen along.
Again, this is NOT the way I would do a hike with my kids, or anyone else's, but does it rise to the level of "Neglect"? Not based on what I've heard and read, or what I have experience as a Paramedic and former child care worker. At least not when compared to what many parents put their families through. This could be a very positive thing. On two occasions law enforcement has become involved and on two occasions the family was allowed to continue on. Apparently they did not feel it was such a drastic situation that they needed to insist on action. Does this exonerate the Mom entirely, of course not, but based on all I've heard, and compared to other situations I've seen first hand, I say it is proper at this time to mind my own business and look the other way. At least until some REAL evidence of neglect or mistreatment can be given.
No offense meant to LW, TOW of anyone else. I said earlier in this thread that I felt it should not be discussed so openly or (as other also pointed out) the whereabouts of the family given. It appears that the second half of that has been taken heed of, and everyone gets kudos from me for correcting that. I just thought, since the discussion continues anyway, I would voice my opinion in mild support of this family. Or, if not support, then at least not totally condemning this Mom's behavior. Just looking at it from a realistic point of view, not an ideal.
well said................
Is it? I don't know, I'm too lazy to read a book this morning, so I'll take your word
Fifty dollars total for 5 nights of stay for 6 (or is it 7) people is a substantial donation????? I don't think so. She only paid for one night out of five. If she didn't have the money, she should not have stayed. A partially used container of laundry soap and some toilet paper does not make up for what she owes them. And yes, she owes them and stated so in her journal. She figured they would be understanding because of their connection to the church. She took advantage of them. Period.
Hiking skills could not help this young kid if someone had tried to abduct him. Thank goodness LW and others were there to take him under their wing.
Some people take the straight and narrow. Others the road less traveled. I just cut through the woods.
The boy has O.D.D. not A.D.D. Big difference. Totally agree with Creek Dancer and HikerMom and John!
Well, it's just hard to understand. I admit, I prefere ideal to realistic, without full knowledge, in this situation.
They will most likely be in my "backyard" very soon. I'm looking forward to meeting them, if I were to get so lucky.
My daughter wanted my trail name to be Spainish Inquisition instead of Angel- So if she's open to sharing her story, I'll be all ears. If things don't seem right, IMHO, I will not look the other way. For me, I wouldn't be able to get a good night's sleep, at night, if I did.
It's easier to ignore right-wing religious nuts than it is to ignore ones with real problems that can be treated with proper care.... just saying.
Couldn't wait for the opportunity to express some religious / political hate this morning?
"Waning Gibbous" would be a great trail name.
Haha. I vote for "Spanish Inquisition" too!! Has much more character about it! "Angel" is so common. You deserve a name with pizzazz!!
“Evil flourishes when good men do nothing.”
~British statesman Edmund Burke
Old Hiker
AT Hike 2012 - 497 Miles of 2184
AT Thru Hiker - 29 FEB - 03 OCT 2016 2189.1 miles
Just because my teeth are showing, does NOT mean I'm smiling.
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