Whistleblower at AMC

[kayak karl]

Are you saying that theft is ok, or not important, if it's just a little?

never said it was OK. as a business owner i try to control theft. how i react will be determined by the amount stolen. is it worth cameras? is it internal or customer theft? i do use mock customers to catch the moonlighters. a $10 a day i might write off as clerical.
i think that with this amount of money missing at a hut it would be very hard and expensive to prove it. i am sure there is more graft going on daily that they should be concentrating on. the more money coming, the more it covers a multitude of sin. this is the same in any company.

[mudhead]

[QUOTE=max patch;1329279]Gee, did mudhead get his name because he likes to sling mud? That comment was not necessary.

Heck I was trying to be civil. People that speak well of the huts strike me as urban, professional, and generally wearing enough expensive garments to gag a maggot.

They do not cater to me. Well maybe they do. They have water, and porches, and killer babe legs.

[hikerboy57]

Ive stayed at the huts maybe 10 or 12 times over the years and have met many section hikers and thru hikers and others like me who simply like the convenience to explore some great trails with just a daypack.im far from rich,much prefer to tent,but i can go really light.try going up the great gully trail with full pack,youll see what i mean.if i were to thru i doubt i would stay at more than 1. they are expensive and I also understand why people live just thrhike the at inNew Hampshire feel the way they do about the AMC and the cost of the huts. but for 1 or 2 nights so I could do some really cool stuff why not yes there's plenty of theaspen crowd too. I met some movies and TV actor at lakes and that Madison I met the guy who used to sing the Shaffer jingle.

[WILLIAM HAYES]

right on papa D

[Chaco Taco]

Stayed at Ethan Pond last night. Caretaker was picking up the slack for the last guy at the site that left to go to school. Sifting compost from the privy, moving rocks for water bars. These were some bad apples and should not reflect on the hard working folks out on the trails, not just the AT.

[bamboo bob]

I have done the Whites three times and slept on a few floors. The huts are not for thru-hikers. You get no sleep. The whole AT is really not about thru-hikers. There are a million users and only a few thousand LD hikers. The food is over rated I think. If they pocket the cash I'm not surprised at all. I think the croo has a cruise ship mentality the way they beg for tips constantly. I would prefer it was like the Smokies too but that is not their mission. Its an Alp's hut set up. And as that they are doing what they set out to do.

[Double Wide]

You know, as I read this thread it just makes me sick, some of the attitudes I see. Seriously, who gives a flying eff if people stay in huts? It's like you're looking down your nose at people whose idea of an outdoor adventure is different than your own. So what--you're a *real* backpacker and they aren't. Big whoop. At least they're out there enjoying the mountains in a way that appeals to them. Isn't that the essence of 'Hike your own hike'? I mean, I hear in on here all the time, but it seems like a big disclaimer, like "Well, as long as I say 'hike your own hike' I can insult and nit-pick your way of doing things". Man, enough is enough.

I've never met Rainman or 10-K, but as a relative beginner to the sport of backpacking, they would be two of the FIRST people I'd seek out for advice. They've got more miles under their boots than most folks on here, I'd imagine, yet I never hear them sneering at other people who we share the trail with. That's right, I said 'share'. The White Mountains aren't just for thru-hikers, and to say that the huts 'cater to someone like you' not only sounds like conceit, but also a good bit of you-don't-know-what-the-hell-you're-talking-about.

Funny thing is, I read a lot of asshatted opinions and comments here on the forum, but out on the trail, running into people who are out there actually, you know, hiking, everyone is friendly and helpful and pretty much non-judgemental (except for the occasional gram-weenie I've encountered).

Maybe we should try to be just as friendly and helpful here on WB as we are out on the trail. Otherwise, this place is ruined by a few bad apples, just like the crews in the AMC huts.

[rainmaker]

[QUOTE=Rain Man;1329220]Well, I've surely been put in my place. Just returned yesterday from almost two weeks of hiking the AT in New Hampshire, including staying as a paying guest in Galehead Hut and Lakes of the Clouds Hut, plus getting breakfast at Mizpah Spring Hut and lunch at Lonesome Lake and Zealand Falls Huts.

Other nights I stayed in the woods, on porches, in a motel, and such.

Just count me among the clueless about "actual" hiking and "actual" life in the woods.
Rain Man

Tell 'em cousin. I went through there last year on my wat to Katahdin and stayed at Zealand Falls, Madison, and Carter. I paid full price by credit card. Why? Because it was my hike and I wanted to.
Rainmaker

[adamkrz]

If it's a weekday and the timing is right I stay at the huts because I saved the money and spend most other days in my tent, The food has always been good and enjoy the pleasure of the company.


I can remember a few years back when the weather took a bad turn and was lucky enough to get to a hut and ride out a huge storm, also I almost never pay full price with the deals they send to my e-mail.

[T.S.Kobzol]

Actually it is as far from the Alps system as it can be

The food is over rated
The prices are 3x more expensive than Huts in the Alps
In the Alps the Huts are required to keep a few spots open as they are by law not allowed to refuse a hiker if they arrive at time when it is no longer safe to hike to another hut or town.

I wish the AMC built additional shelters on the pres range similar to lodges on the LT. $5 bucks per night would get you a plank and that's it. Leave the expensive Huts for families who can afford to shell out close to $400.per night for a family of four.

I have done the Whites three times and slept on a few floors. The huts are not for thru-hikers. You get no sleep. The whole AT is really not about thru-hikers. There are a million users and only a few thousand LD hikers. The food is over rated I think. If they pocket the cash I'm not surprised at all. I think the croo has a cruise ship mentality the way they beg for tips constantly. I would prefer it was like the Smokies too but that is not their mission. Its an Alp's hut set up. And as that they are doing what they set out to do.

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2

[Supreme Being]

You know, as I read this thread it just makes me sick, some of the attitudes I see. Seriously, who gives a flying eff if people stay in huts? It's like you're looking down your nose at people whose idea of an outdoor adventure is different than your own. So what--you're a *real* backpacker and they aren't. Big whoop. At least they're out there enjoying the mountains in a way that appeals to them. Isn't that the essence of 'Hike your own hike'? I mean, I hear in on here all the time, but it seems like a big disclaimer, like "Well, as long as I say 'hike your own hike' I can insult and nit-pick your way of doing things". Man, enough is enough.

I've never met Rainman or 10-K, but as a relative beginner to the sport of backpacking, they would be two of the FIRST people I'd seek out for advice. They've got more miles under their boots than most folks on here, I'd imagine, yet I never hear them sneering at other people who we share the trail with. That's right, I said 'share'. The White Mountains aren't just for thru-hikers, and to say that the huts 'cater to someone like you' not only sounds like conceit, but also a good bit of you-don't-know-what-the-hell-you're-talking-about.

Funny thing is, I read a lot of asshatted opinions and comments here on the forum, but out on the trail, running into people who are out there actually, you know, hiking, everyone is friendly and helpful and pretty much non-judgemental (except for the occasional gram-weenie I've encountered).

Maybe we should try to be just as friendly and helpful here on WB as we are out on the trail. Otherwise, this place is ruined by a few bad apples, just like the crews in the AMC huts.

Really glad you had the courage to address this. I can't be the only one who has noticed that there seems to be a sort of "reverse discrimination" going on here at WB. I can't begin to count the posts who have put down hikers with "nice" clothes or equipment or made some other snide remark. I believe that most hikers here are middle class and many are hikers who work 6 months out of the year in order to fund their hikes the rest of the year. They don't have much, but they don't seem to need much. There are very few "independently wealthy" hikers on WB. And I suspect that those who are have worked pretty hard for it.

Everyone here loves to hike and that should be the common thread without anyone putting down others for staying in huts or the kind of equipment they have or the clothes they wear or the shoes on their feet. It shouldn't matter about the weight of your pack or what's in that pack. And God love ya if you are hauling a big, heavy pack because you need our sympathy more than most.

For a group that preaches, "HIKE YOUR OWN HIKE" - maybe it would be wise to practice this motto on this site. There are a lot of hikers here with a lot of miles under their belt and obviously they are doing just fine.

[peakbagger]

I have a 1-1/2 inch thick copy of the Environmental Impact Statement that AMC was forced to develop when the huts were up for relicensing. They had to look at three options, No huts, limited caretaker services and what they have now. Many of the huts are in restricted use areas and the option of setting up campsites in place of the huts would not be allowed. The USFS conclusion was that the hut system as it exists today is the best of the worst options for these high use areas. The options for shelters in addition to huts is very limited, if you look carefully at USFS maps, they got quite creative in making jogs in wilderness area boundaries. Bascially the odds of anything new being built is slim to none due to the massive effort that would be required to get them permitted. THe AMC and USFS has basically resorted to fixing what is there and having a caretaker in place at the high use sites to try to minimize the impact whihc mostly consists of composting waste from the outhouse.

Realistically AMC manages the huts for a specific clientel who have been going there for years and likes the value they recieve, unfortunately thru hikers arent their clientel so they manage them as best as they can.

[Marta]

To put the price of the AMC huts in perspective... There are a couple of huts in Glacier National Park. I toyed with the idea of staying in one. $90 per night AND you have to pack in your own food and WATER. Yikes!

[hikerboy57]

To put the price of the AMC huts in perspective... There are a couple of huts in Glacier National Park. I toyed with the idea of staying in one. $90 per night AND you have to pack in your own food and WATER. Yikes!

apparently the only place where the huts are worthwhile is in the Alps.

[greenmtnboy]

Sounds like an audit is well overdue! Any financial fraud is against the law and should be turned over to the relevant authorities. If the hut system hand picks attractive "well-adjusted" college students who are going to $40K a year colleges the rest of the year, something is not right!

[Chaco Taco]

Sounds like an audit is well overdue! Any financial fraud is against the law and should be turned over to the relevant authorities. If the hut system hand picks attractive "well-adjusted" college students who are going to $40K a year colleges the rest of the year, something is not right!

They arent hand picking anyone. They are taking whoever signs up. The numbers are way down for caretakers and croo members as in recent years. Its a thankless job dealing with everyday BS from people that dont know how to treat people. Most of the time, Im sure its fine. The caretakers we talk to always have a great attitude. Every once in awhile, some hiker comes along a screws it up for others and complains and is disrespectful when they dont get there way.

[Duramax22]

I can't imagine why anyone would pay to stay in a Hut. I just hiked the Whites from VT 4 to Pinkham Notch last month and saw no need whatsoever to stay in the huts - - I did pay $10 to stay in the Dungeon of the Lake of the Clouds Hut but certainly not a full fare - the rest was LNT stealth camping or $8 tent platforms, which is sensible.
Putting this as respectably as possible, to me, it seemed like the Hut guests were mostly clueless about actual hiking and about actual life in the woods. They were more like people you see at a ski resort - totally dependent on artificial things constructed on a mountain (like ski lifts and warming huts) - - they sipped their mugs of hot chocolate and ate from their monster bags of gorp and had this look on their face like "wow, we're really roughing-it" - it seemed so hokey from the perspective of someone who actually walks long distances and gets things done on their own. I really don't care if someone takes these people's money - like PT Barnum said, "There's a sucker born every minute."

So true. I felt the same way back in July after a 25mile hike we spent our last night on mt leconte in the shelter and we were known as the the "other people" to the folks in the lodge. After talking to them I quickly learned they were all from the big city and thought they were living like Davy Crockett out here in the "jungle" lol. One of the guys in the shelter was playing a harmonica and the folks from the lodge came over and were starring at us like we were animals at the zoo. They never did come up to the shelter, just kept there distance and watched. Was actually pretty funny.

[hikerboy57]

didn't know the AMC ran a lodge in mt leconte.

[tdoczi]

didn't know the AMC ran a lodge in mt leconte.

they dont. just as the amc doesnt run phanton ranch at the grand canyon, the chalets in glacier or the high camps in yosemite. amc doesnt have the market on that sort of thing cornered. same concept though.

[Marta]

apparently the only place where the huts are worthwhile is in the Alps.

We stayed in huts when we hiked in Finnish Lapland a couple of years ago. Ten euros a night for the reserved side of the huts. Free on the other side. Talk about swanky--I could live forever in one of these huts. Cute as can be. Compared to other huts in Finland, we were told these were "primitive" because you have to bring your own food. But for ten euros you get a bed, blankets, and pillow, kitchen with propane stove and all cooking and eating utensils, Jotul stove and woodshed full of firewood, stainless steel water pail and dipper, the nicest privies I have ever seen... Unbelievable. Especially since the weather can be pretty foul, and the terrain is exceedingly rocky.