Constant stream of patronizing comments from men

[Karma13]

Well said, Pendragon and everyone.

The important thing I try to remember is that I'm not obligated to engage. I can always nod politely and just be on my way, off hiking my own hike -- not faster because of them, or slower, or more or less worried, or feeling anything at all about them. I don't have to be more than reasonably polite, and I can just go about my business. Which is putting one foot after the other.

Easier said than done, but I'm working on it
!

--Karma

[Deadeye]

patronizing advice is not limited to ones sex.

+1 You are not alone! I get all kinds of comments like "slow down and enjoy the hike" (as if I'm not enjoying myself!), or comments about my age or abilities. Some people have no filter, others are genuinely concerned, others just don't care or don't "get it". I'm often amazed at hikers that insist on grilling other hikers about their routes, etc., or make assumptions that you're going their way... I'll stop before a full rant status is acheived.

I start hikes with a nice OMmmmmm to get in the right mindset so I can ignore ignorami.

[Karma13]

"Ignorami" may be my new favorite word.

[Marta]

Lots of fun stories.

Yeah, Garlic, the "How did your spouse let you go?" question shows an amazingly narrow view of the ways people who are part of couples can relate to each other.

Several of the women I've talked the recent incident over with agreed that a great number of women have drunk the KoolAid and have let people talk them into being afraid to do stuff alone, from going to movies to hiking to following any sort of personal dream.

Fwiw, my standard reply to the "You're alone?" comment is, "If you wait for a crowd, you won't do much."

How's the Solemate 50 high point quest going?

[The Old Boot]

I get mansplained to all the time, and not just about hiking. Also, age-splained. (As in, a certain proportion of strangers think I turned 50 and my brain fell out. The patronizing is second only to the fact that I've apparently become more invisible than I used to be.)

I love hearing other people's tips and tricks and information -- as long as it's offered with the assumption that I know what I'm doing, not that I need rescuing.

--Karma

I love it!! - I've been subjected to 'mansplained' all my life - mechanics, plumbers, electricians, the guy in the building supply place, you name it.

You should have seen all the 'mansplain' I heard whenever I pulled a 35' Class A RV with 14' of trailer on behind it all over the eastern seaboard of the US. I could be parking in a 100 acre open field and 10 guys would pop out of groundhog holes to tell me how to park the thing!!

It's something about being female, blonde and short that just starts the whole thing off.

I tend to just roll my eyes and carry on - nothing I can say is gonna make it go away!

And now, I'm also getting a combination of that and age-splained...sigh

My new two favourite words - Thanks Karma!!

[hikerboy57]

+1 You are not alone! I get all kinds of comments like "slow down and enjoy the hike" (as if I'm not enjoying myself!), or comments about my age or abilities. Some people have no filter, others are genuinely concerned, others just don't care or don't "get it". I'm often amazed at hikers that insist on grilling other hikers about their routes, etc., or make assumptions that you're going their way... I'll stop before a full rant status is acheived.

I start hikes with a nice OMmmmmm to get in the right mindset so I can ignore ignorami.

you're doing it all wrong.
this past summer, i was at chairback shelter in maine end of the day, daylight fading. a sobo knew it was 8 miles to the next shelter, decided to go for it. I knew it was close to impossible to get there before dark, thought about mentioning it to him, then let him go without my "sage advice". it was his hike, not mine, and maybe he felt comfortable in the dark with just headlamp. i dont know if he ever reached that shelter that night, maybe he stealthed somewhere, but i find that no matter how much time i spend on WB and other sites to get opinions, the best teacher is still experience.ive learned something new almost every single time ive taken a trip.
part of it is everone would like to be helpful, but are we to judge someone else.
3 years ago, i was suffering from heat exhaustion at Lafayette, trying to gt to garfield campsite, totally out of water. at the base of garfield i ran into 2 guys doing the bonds, one of which was carrying a pack that had to be close to 70 lbs for a 3 day trip.I asked if he had any water to spare and he pulled out a gallon jug of poland spring.
he may have been doing it wrong, but i was sure glad he had packed in all that water!

[Hairbear]

ive been witness to such attitudes with men talking to women.i have to examine myself and what i see is that we are taught to be protectors from birth.you know what i mean when your young and go to school you are told that if you dont protect your sister you will have to deal with dad when you get home.we go from that to protecting our wives and kids.we are taught that if we cant we are inferior as men,we are not supposed to cry or have emotions.some take this to extremes.since this comes from a subconcience level maybe it should be seen as uncontrolabe other than a snipe attempt.maybe they see you as a woman first and it triggers the whole if something happens to you out there it his fault.then he opens his mouth and concern turns to stupidity right before your eyes.

[hikerboy57]

on one hand i have found some of the most ardent feminists still smile if i hold the door for them.on the other hand ive met women on my hikes that would outhike me in a heartbeat.i met a few sobos this summer who certainly didnt need my help(and i was smart enough not to offer it), carried the same weight i did, did the same miles, and all i could do was smile at the end of the day when i found them camping at the same site i was.

[Driver8]

Ladies, does this happen to you, too?

i was passing through Polebridge last Saturday morning. Stopped at the Mercantile for a pastry. There was a guy there ten years older than I am who had just finished a multi-day hike starting at Kintla Lake. I had a backcountry permit for that night for Upper Kintla Lake.

The driving directions were unclear. I asked him which road to take to get to Kintla Lake. He quizzed me about my plans. Car camping? No, Backcountry permit. Kintla Lake? No, Upper Kintla.

He looked down his nose at me. "That's TWELVE MILES," he said. "You'd better stop at the Kintla campsite." Then he told me, with a similar tone of voice, that I'd have to drive on a single-lane road to get there, as if that might frighten me.

I mean, ***! This sort of thing happens constantly.

I had just finished the JMT and was coming DOWN Mt. Whitney, dancing from rock to rock in joy at how good I felt. Some random guy trudging uphill said, "You'd better slow down. You might hurt yourself."

I gave him a level look and replied, "You have no idea what I can do."

Is it just me? Am I particularly helpless/clueless-looking? Or do a lot of male hikers try to pump themselves up by giving unsolicited patronizing advice to every woman they run into? Or do they give lots of patronizing advice to male hikers as well?

Share your stories!

I also, seldom but not never, get patronizing comments due, I believe, to my chubbiness. I was headed up the Jewell Trail on my victorious first full ascent of Mt. Washington in June. At about 5200', not far from the Gulfside junction, I came across a sour, very fit young man, probably 25, who was hiking for the day with his dad and his dad's friend. One got the sense he was chafing at having to hike with the slower oldsters, and thus took a bit of it out on me. He snarked at my shoes, which have a couple of holes in them, and warned me in menacing tones about heading down via Ammonoosuc Ravine Trail. I thanked him and advised that I had gone up and down it with ice and snow in the upper reaches five weeks before and confidently predicted I'd make it fine, if only my shoes held out. They did and I did.

Young Mr. Sour was one of the few down notes on one of my happiest days to date, and I didn't take his surly efforts to patronize me to heart. Reckon it's his problem, his mean attitude, not mine. I try to adopt the same attitude to a few sour sorts I run into online, though sometimes I can't resist mixing it up with one or two on occasion. Much less frequently with time, happy to say.

As to female hikers, I greet them as with any other hiker and gauge their level of fitness and expertise case-by-case when passing out helpful trail advice, etc. I'm usually just happy to socialize for a moment or two - I like other hikers, whatever their background, like hiking, like learning from and sharing with them.

[HikerMom58]

I think this thread just proved that we have some great guys on this site...just sayin!

[Driver8]

I think this thread just proved that we have some great guys on this site...just sayin!

Great people, HikerMom. And I believe you're just fine and needn't get a complex about your fears and insecurities. You got it right when you said that your confidence will grow with every new mile on trail. it's true for all of us - certainly true for me. Two years and a summer ago, I weighed 40 lbs more, maybe 50, and was much more anxious about all aspects of hiking. The more you know and the stronger you become, the further the worries recede.

[hikerboy57]

I think this thread just proved that we have some great guys on this site...just sayin!

i hope you're not patronizing us

[1azarus]

I don't think agism is as rampant as sexism... I can only imagine what the two combined would be like. You have my sympathy. When people use their eyes to determine more than sex they can often figure out experience level from equipment and posture clues. If someone sees you, Marta, with your pack on and doesn't offer you respect, well, they don't have mine. Did this guy see you standing up with your pack on? Formidable!

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

[HikerMom58]

Thanks Driver8, everything you said is true!! BTW... I looked at your pics that you posted... very nice!

Who me? Patronize anyone? NEVERRRRRR!!

[HeartFire]

Marta,
as I read through all the posts, I tried to think if this has ever happened to me. I don't know, if it did I didn't pay any attention to it, because I can't think of a single incident where something like this pissed me off. So did it just not happen, or did it not bother me that I don't remember? I think I might have responded to his "12 miles" with something like "yeah, I was going to do 25 but decided to take a short day." (to put him in his place). Just take a deep breath and go hike.

[Wise Old Owl]

[QUOTE=Moose2001;1337368]

Am I particularly helpless/clueless-looking? Or do a lot of male hikers try to pump themselves up by giving unsolicited patronizing advice to every woman they run into?* Or do they give lots of patronizing advice to male hikers as well?QUOTE]

Hey Marta - good question. My answer is there are people who just love to give unsolicited and patronizing advice to anyone and everyone they meet. There are people, both on the trail and off, who go through life validating their existence by tearing down others. Sad...but true. I've had similar experiences as Stumpknocker where someone wants to tell me what and how much to carry despite having 4 thrus under my belt. I just smile and tell them my pack is none of their business and they need to learn what the true meaning of "Hike Your Own Hike" is. I've also learned that nothing shuts up the know-it-alls faster than blowing by them on an uphill. I get past them and laugh as loud as possible.

*Yes they do to both male and females.... like a bad scoutmaster. (I am not)

Marta GREAT THREAD IDEA! I have always been a little bombastic and prideful and it shows in my posts. I jump to the gun and wear my feelings on my shoulder, I too am GUILTY as charged. - You all have seen my posts and thoughts over the years. I never intended to be mean to others. I thank you all for correcting me when I screw up, and if it were not for paying the donations for the Edit button... well you can guess.

To make up for it all the friends I have made and wonderful people that have been there and stood by me in spite of my faults. The wonderful posts and PM's that I receive makes it really nice to be a part of WB.

I have some great people that I work with, and I have one condescending, sarcastic, Drama Queen of a person in my office who has dished it out on me and a few others. He is brilliant and knowledgeable, and while working with him he has at times been flat out unbearable. He still cares, and shows it at the strangest times, as we are oil and water since I got there. In my position I now do not ask him for help and avoid questions as its a huge waste of time on his part. He is a still great guy & can be easy to get along with most of the time.

So yes I understand your post. As a group we forget, these unsolicited behaviors are from people that are misunderstood and a tad strange because they think they are helpful and we now know better because of this. They simply lack a social filter in their thought process.

Some older uneducated men are still in the "women belong in the kitchen" mode and you are not going to change them, sad really for them, brush off what happened to you and "wish them a nice day" I honestly can say I avoid some of these men, while others are a great inspiration to me and I enjoy their company.

My inspiration is my companion, my wife of 28 years. Deanna.

Once again, you have the best thought provoking threads and as much as I love WB, I refrain from posting here because I respect your space. Thanks again.

I will check back for replies.

[Capt Nat]

I really appreciate this thread too... See, I am one of those "older, uneducated men" and I've experienced the wrath of strong willed females a time or two when I held a door, gave up my seat, and said yes Mam or no Mam. I know that the world has changed and that yall now make more and can do more and are more capable than me. I know that you are often more capable than me. I've never doubted that most of you are smarter than me.

Please appreciate than from my earliest memory, my Dad taught me to favor women, not in a condenscending way, but out of respect and in acknowledgement of what a special gift from God that you are. If my Dad sees me sitting while you stand, if he sees me fail to treat you with an elevated sense of respect, he will return from the grave and berate me. I would rather offend your sense of superiority than disappoint him, so until I pass on, you are just going to have to deal with it. Luckily for you, I don't have any advice to offer, so please just take the seat, step through the door, flash me that smile that lights up my day, and humour me.

[Marta]

I don't think agism is as rampant as sexism... I can only imagine what the two combined would be like. You have my sympathy. When people use their eyes to determine more than sex they can often figure out experience level from equipment and posture clues. If someone sees you, Marta, with your pack on and doesn't offer you respect, well, they don't have mine. Did this guy see you standing up with your pack on? Formidable!

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

No, he didn't see the pack--it was in the car. But even when I'm hiking along, wearing my stained, stinky clothing, and carrying my ratty old pack, many people still seem shocked that I'm out and about on my own.

I have done quite a bit of day hiking in Glacier NP this summer, because of the difficulty of getting backcountry permits sometimes. My daypack is festooned with souvenirs patches. They're so old I'd forgotten about them, but have been reminded by the reactions of my fellow hikers on the park's more popular trails. maybe I should sew some on my hat, or something. ;-)

I did indulge in a little bragging to persuade the ranger in the backcountry permit office to issue the permit. He was unsure I could make the 12 miles, with a massive 400' in elevation gain! (the trail leads along the shore of one lake, then you climb a tiny bit, then go along the shore of another lake--a gorgeous hike), so I let him know that the previous Sunday I had done Lincoln Lake as a day hike, which is 16 miles, many of which are steepish, with plenty of daylight to spare.

As far as the manners of well-brought-up men....I gave up biting your heads off when I was a teenager. Kindness makes all our days brighter.

[Marta]

I'm not a super-fit hiker or awesome athlete. I know that. What bugs me is people who assume that I don't have the sense to know what I can and can't do.

Shouldn't we all give each other then benefit of the doubt?

My practice is to offer respect until the person proves they don't deserve it.

[Dances with Mice]

Were his comments patronizing or condescending?

You do know what condescending means don't you? It's when you talk down to someone.


I disagree that you aren't an awesome athlete.