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  1. #21
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    I also think that running form depends on your leg strength/power and your weight. If you have lost strength/power and gained weight, your running form will change even at the same specific speed. I can still manage to run a 6 minute mile at 200 pounds, but not with the same form I would at 165 pounds, and certainly not like a 4-5 minute miler would when running a 6 minute mile. I need to take more strides over the same distance, with a lot less hang time. The 4-5 minute miler even when running at 6 minutes per mile is taking a longer stride, not so much because they are reaching further, simply because they have, relative to their weight, more explosive power and less ground contact time. They get more distance out of each stride with less relative effort. It looks like they are running slower. They make it look easy, because for them, it is. It's not about technique. It's about power to weight ratio.

  2. #22

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    How about this: “It’s just math”.

    When you start looking at the math of running at a given pace per mile and extrapolate that out for a given distance, i.e. a 5K, 15K, 26.2, etc… This is about as simple as math can get, yet I can’t help but to keep coming back and looking at the numbers, as if I just don’t get or if there’s some way I can get a different result, but I can’t, it’s about as easy as math gets. It’s just math.

    Then I noticed that a book I have (The Complete Runner's Day-by-Day Log and Calendar) has pacing for a marathon, based on paces from a 5 hour marathon to a 2:04 marathon. But I noticed the numbers were not adding up, i.e. if you were on a 2:11 pace, which is 5 min/mile than the last 0.2 mile would be completed in 1 minute, but it also takes one minute in the last 0.2 for a 2:10 and 2:09 and there are a lot of other anomalies that I just don’t get. And then in the mile-to-mile times many don’t add up, i.e. if you do a mile in say, 10:53, then every mile after that should be another 10:53, but they're not It's not big errors, but what are they doing? It doesn't seem to be just simple errors.




    Found this website, but haven’t had time to look at it in-depth, but it does seem to do better than the chart in my book. The book rounds off so to not have fractions of a second, but that doesn’t answer why there are differences in minute’s mile-from-mile. http://checkersac.org/Coach/marathon...pace_chart.htm


    Anyone else notice these little discrepancies in other books on pacing?

  3. #23

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    Good article on weekly running distances. Since coming back from an illness that sidelined me for the entire summer I've started logging my runs, currently I'm doing about 20 miles per week and going to increase them now, because I'm completely over any pains I had once I started back up running; I'm at the point where my times are coming down fast, so I want to up the mileage.

    This article poses a very interesting question: Is there a set limit (in absolute terms) for everyone? I'm on the fence about that question. http://www.runnersworld.com/health/1...on?page=single


    The 10 Laws of Injury Prevention

    Follow these time-tested principles and you'll spend more time on the roads—and less in rehab

    By Amby Burfoot;

    Image by Kagan McLeod



    Published January 29, 2010


    In the mid-1970s, Runner's World medical editor George Sheehan, M.D., confirmed that he was hardly the only runner beset by injuries: A poll of the magazine's readers revealed that 60 percent reported chronic problems. "One person in 100 is a motor genius," who doesn't have injuries, concluded the often-sidelined Sheehan. To describe himself and the rest of us, he turned to Ralph Waldo Emerson: "There is a crack in everything God has made." With all the amazing advancements in sports medicine, you'd think that our rates of shinsplints and stress fractures would have dropped since Sheehan's era. But 30 years after running's first Big Boom, we continue to get hurt. A recent runnersworld.com poll revealed that 66 percent of respondents had suffered an injury in 2009.

    Still, I figured medical science must have uncovered lots of little-known prevention secrets. So I went searching for them. After reviewing hundreds of published papers, I was surprised to find few answers. Most of the studies are retrospective, looking back. A few are prospective, looking forward. Even then, they're not the gold standard, which are randomized, controlled, double blind experiments. And conflicting results make it difficult to draw meaningful conclusions. I learned, for example, that running injuries can be caused by being female, being male, being old, being young, pronating too much, pronating too little, training too much, and training too little. Studies also indicate that the "wet test" doesn't help shoe selection, old shoes don't offer less cushioning than newer shoes, and leg-length discrepancies don't cause injuries (but too-little sleep does). Oh, here's good news: To get rid of blisters, you should drink less and smoke more.

    Clearly, the medical studies wouldn't offer much help. So I switched to Plan B: I interviewed nearly a dozen of the best running-injury experts in the world. They come from the fields of biomechanics, sports podiatry, and physical therapy. Like the medical studies, these experts didn't always agree. But the more I talked with them, the more certain principles began to emerge. From these, I developed the following 10 laws of injury prevention. I can't guarantee that these rules will prevent you from ever getting hurt. But if you incorporate these
    guidelines into your training, I'm confident you'll be more likely to enjoy a long and healthy running life.

    Know Your Limits

    It's easy to get injured; anyone can do it. Just run too much. "I firmly believe that every runner has an injury threshold," says physical therapist and biomechanist Irene Davis, Ph.D., from the University of Delaware's Running Injury Clinic. "Your threshold could be at 10 miles a week, or 100, but once you exceed it, you get injured." Various studies have identified injury-thresholds at 11, 25, and 40 miles per week. Your threshold is waiting for you to discover it.

    Of course, your goal is to avoid injury. Runner and sports podiatrist Stephen Pribut, D.P.M., warns runners to beware the "terrible toos"—doing too much, too soon, too fast. Every research paper and every expert agrees that this—"training errors"—is the number one cause of self-inflicted running injuries. The body needs time to adapt from training changes and jumps in mileage or intensity. Muscles and joints need recovery time so they can recover and handle more training demands. If you rush that process, you could break down rather than build up.

    Running experts have recognized this problem, and long ago devised an easy-to-use 10-percent rule: Build your weekly training mileage by no more than 10 percent per week. If you run 10 miles the first week, do just 11 miles the second week, 12 miles the third week, and so on.
    Yet, there may be times when even a modest 10 percent increase proves too much. Biomechanist Reed Ferber, Ph.D., an assistant professor in the faculty of kinesiology and head of the Running Injury Clinic at the University of Calgary says that he sees a lot of newly injured runners during that third month of marathon training, when a popular 16-week Canadian program pushes the mileage hard. Meanwhile, his clinic's nine-month marathon program for first-timers increases mileage by just three percent per week. "We have a 97 percent success rate getting people through the entire program and to the marathon finish line," Ferber says.

    ACTION PLAN


    Be the Tortoise, not the Hare. Increase your weekly and monthly running totals gradually. Use the 10-percent rule as a general guideline, but realize that it might be too aggressive for you—especially if you are injury-prone. A five-percent or three-percent increase might be more appropriate. In addition to following a hard-day/easy-day approach, or more likely a hard/easy/easy pattern, many top runners use a system where they scale back their weekly mileage by 20 to 40 percent on a regular basis, maybe once a month. And remember that mileage isn't the only issue. Experts point out that an overly aggressive approach to hill running, intervals, trail running—indeed, any change in your training habits—can produce problems. Keeping a detailed training log can help you gauge your personal training threshold. Record your weekly mileage and how you feel after your runs. Look for patterns. For instance, you may notice that your knees ache only when you're logging more than 40 miles a week.
    Another major bugaboo: You used to run 30 miles a week, you got injured, now you want to get back to your old routine as quickly as possible. Don't. Take your time. The same applies to that upcoming race—if you missed some training time, don't accelerate the pace and distance of your remaining workouts in an effort to "catch up." Instead, adjust your goals as needed.
    Listen to Your Body

    This is perhaps the oldest and most-widely-repeated advice for avoiding injuries, and still the best: If you don't run through pain, you can nip injuries in the bud. Most running injuries don't erupt from nowhere and blindside you. They produce signals—aches, soreness, persistent pain—but it's up to you to not dismiss them and take appropriate (in)action. "Runners can be crazy the way they'll run through pain," Ferber says. "They need to pay more attention to pain and get to the root of what's causing it."

    ACTION PLAN


    At the first sign of an atypical pain (discomfort that worsens during a run or causes you to alter your gait), take three days off. Substitute light walking, water training, or bicycling if you want. On the fourth day, run half your normal easy-day amount at a much slower pace than usual. If you typically run four miles at nine minutes per mile, do just two miles at 11-minute pace. Success? Excellent. Reward yourself with another day off, and then run three miles at 10-minute pace. If you're pain-free, continue easing back into your normal routine. If not, take another three days off, then repeat the process to see if it works the second time around. If not, you've got two obvious options: Take more time off, and/or schedule an appointment with a sports-medicine specialist.

    Consider Shortening Your Stride

    This comes as a bit of a surprise because it's not discussed much in running circles. Nonetheless, more than half the experts I interviewed mentioned it. And a December 2009 study reports that runners who shorten their stride by 10 percent could reduce risk of tibial stress fracture by three to six percent. The basic idea: Overstriding is a common mistake that can lead to decreased efficiency and increased injury risk. If you shorten your stride, you'll land "softer" with each footfall, incurring lower impact forces. "A shorter stride will usually lower the impact force, which should reduce injuries," says biomechanist Alan Hreljac, Ph.D., a retired researcher from California State University-Sacramento.
    For the last decade, Davis has been researching runners' abilities to change their stride. Previously, experts believed that your stride was as immutable as your fingerprint, but Davis has used biofeedback equipment to disprove the old view. "We have shown that running and walking gait can be altered in such a way as to reduce pain, improve function, and reduce injury risk," she says.

    ACTION PLAN


    If you've had frequent running injuries, you might want to experiment running with your normal stride, just slightly shorter—about 10 percent. "This will help reduce your stride so you have more turnover," Davis says. "The number of footstrikes or repetitions trumps having a longer stride because it reduces your impact load." Start with a short distance, like a quarter mile, when making this change. If you have an injury that's related to your gait, see a physical therapist.
    Use Strength Training To Balance Your Body

    You need something—and what better than muscle?—to keep your body properly aligned while you're running down the road at 450 pounds of crunching, twisting-in, and torquing-out force per stride. According to Ferber, it's particularly important to strengthen the hip muscles. He claims his clinic has cured 92 percent of knee injuries with a hip regimen. "Strengthening the hips is optimal for effective rehabilitation, as opposed to treating the area where the pain is located (e.g., your knee)," he says. "When you strengthen the hips—the abductors, adductors, and gluteus maximus—you increase your leg stability all the way down to the ankle."

    ACTION PLAN


    You don't want to train for bulging muscles. You need just enough core, hip, and lower-leg strength training to keep your pelvis and lower-extremity joints properly positioned. "Healthy running should be as symmetrical and fluid as possible," says Michael Fredericson, M.D., associate professor of sports medicine at Stanford University School of Medicine. "If you don't have muscle balance, then you lose the symmetry, and that's when you start having problems."
    RICE Works

    When you've got muscle aches or joint pains, there's nothing better than rest, ice, compression, and elevation for immediate treatment. These measures can relieve pain, reduce swelling, and protect damaged tissues, all of which speed healing. The only problem with RICE is that too many runners focus on the "I" while ignoring the "RCE." Ice reduces inflammation, but to ice-and-run, ice-and-run, without giving the tissues enough time to heal, is a little like dieting every day until 6 p.m. and then pigging out. And so Bruce Wilk, an orthopedic rehabilitation specialist in Miami, has added another letter to the acronym, spelling out PRICE. The P stands for "protection," which means don't run until the injury is better.

    ACTION PLAN


    RICE is most effective when done immediately following an injury. If you twist your ankle or strain your hamstring, plan to take a few days off from running (see Law II). Apply ice—for 10 to 15 minutes at a time, several times a day. A homemade ice pack—a baggie filled with ice cubes and water—is best. A bag of frozen vegetables is also effective. If you can, elevate the area (easy for foot and ankle injuries, not so much for hip or hamstring issues) to limit swelling. Compression can also further reduce inflammation and can provide pain relief, especially when you first return to running. An ACE bandage is the simplest way to wrap a swollen area, but Amol Saxena, a sports podiatrist in Palo Alto, California, uses a compression dressing with 3M Coban, a self-adherent over-the-counter product. He then uses Kinesio Tex Tape or a Darco Body Armor Walker for when the swelling goes down. "The tape pulls up the skin slightly, allowing more blood to flow to the injured area," he says. He teaches runners, including 2008 Olympic bronze medalist Shalane Flanagan, how to put it on themselves.
    Run on a Level Surface

    Here's another factor that could have a significant impact on running injuries, but has been rarely studied: road camber. No doubt you always run on the left side of the road facing traffic. That's good for safety reasons. But it also gives you a functional leg-length discrepancy, since your left foot hits the road lower on the slope than your right foot. You're also placing your left foot on a slant that tends to limit healthy pronation, and your right foot in a position that encourages overpronation. And you're doing this—running in an unbalanced way—160 to 180 strides a minute for mile after mile, day after day, week after week. Clint Verran, a physical therapist in Lake Orion, Michigan, sees the results of this cambered running in his clinic, where he treats a higher incidence of left-hip injuries in runners than right-hip injuries.

    ACTION PLAN


    True, it's not easy to escape cambered asphalt. And safety concerns demand that you run on the left side of the road. So now you've already got two strikes against you. To avoid strike three, remember that road camber can cause problems. If you're increasing your mileage, feel an injury coming on, or are returning from injury, try to do some of your training runs on a level surface like a bike path or dirt trail. The local track also provides a firm, essentially flat surface that's great for slow-paced running. (When you do faster interval training on a track, you put unequal torque on your feet and legs due to the need to keep turning left, so be careful if you are injury prone.) Also consider the treadmill. It's hard to imagine a better surface for balanced running. At the very least, a treadmill provides a great surface for beginning runners, runners who are recovering from an injury, and perhaps even marathoners aiming to increase mileage without increasing their injury risk.
    Don't Race Or Do Speedwork Too Often

    Researchers have found a correlation between injuries and frequent race efforts. This connection might extend to speedwork since intervals also require a near-maximal effort. So if you train fast once or twice a week and then race on the weekend, that's a lot of hard efforts without sufficient rest, particularly if you follow this pattern week after week. Some experts are cautious about recommending regular speed training for certain runners, especially those who get hurt easily. It's fine for those chasing podium placements or age-group awards. But for mid-and back-of-the-packers? "You might get five percent faster, but your injury risk could climb by 25 percent," Verran says. "That's a bad risk-benefit ratio. I think most runners can hit their goals without going harder than tempo pace."

    ACTION PLAN


    Recognize that races take a heavy toll, so give yourself plenty of recovery time (one day for each mile raced). If you are trying to quicken your pace for a specific goal, add a weekly speedwork session to your training plan, but be judicious about it. Even Olympic gold medalists only do five to 10 percent of their training at 5-K race pace and faster. If you're coming back from an injury or have chronic issues you're fearful of aggravating, consider Verran's advice. Do your faster workouts at tempo pace (5-K pace plus 25 to 35 seconds per mile).

    Stretch the Back Of Your Legs

    Few running practices are as hallowed as stretching. And none have been debated as much in recent years. Studies have failed to reliably show that the addition of stretching to a warmup before activity reduces overuse injuries. "The jury's been out on stretching for about a decade," says Michael Ryan, Ph.D., a post-doctoral fellow at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. "And as far as I can tell, it hasn't come in yet." Yet few experts in the field are ready to abandon stretching. The reasoning: Runners are tight in predictable areas, they get injured in and around these areas, and therefore they should increase flexibility in these areas. The muscle groups at the back of the legs—the hamstrings and calf muscles—stand atop most lists of "best muscles for runners to stretch." Hamstring and hip-flexor flexibility seems to improve knee function (several reports link poor hamstring and hip-flexor flexibility with "larger knee joint loads"), and calf flexibility may keep the Achilles tendon and plantar fascia healthy.

    ACTION PLAN


    Little evidence indicates that stretching prevents overuse injuries. That said, knee and Achilles problems are among runners' most frequent complaints, and so experts recommend increasing the range of motion of muscles that can strain these areas if there is underlying tightness. Just don't do static stretches (holding an elongated muscle in a fixed position for 30 seconds or longer) before running. However, dynamic stretching can be done as a safe, effective prerun warmup.
    Cross-Training Provides Active Rest and Recovery

    Running is hard on the body, although claims that it creates impact forces up to seven to eight times body weight are exaggerated, according to the experts I consulted. But they acknowledge the forces can reach two to three times body weight with each stride, and even more on downhills. It's no surprise that our muscles, joints, and connective tissues get weary from all this shock-absorbing. So experts agree that most runners benefit from at least one nonrunning day a week, and that injury-prone runners should avoid consecutive days of running. Cross-training offers a great alternative.

    ACTION PLAN


    Use cross-training activities to supplement your running, improve your muscle balance, and keep you injury-free. Swimming, cycling, elliptical training, and rowing will burn a lot of calories and improve your aerobic fitness, but be careful not to aggravate injury-prone areas (see below).

    The Laws of Perpetual Motion: Keep it Safe


    Cross-training can help you stay fit when you can't run. But pick wisely, says podiatrist Stephen Pribut. Some activities may exacerbate an injury.
    Runner's Knee
    Yes, usually okay: Swimming
    Sometimes okay; let pain guide you: Stationary Bike, Elliptical
    No, usually not okay: Rowing Machine
    Iliotibial-Band Syndrome
    Yes, usually okay: Swimming
    Sometimes okay; let pain guide you: Stationary Bike, Elliptical, Rowing Machine
    Calf Strain, Achilles Pain
    Yes, usually okay: Swimming, Stationary Bike, Elliptical, Rowing Machine
    Plantar Fasciitis
    Yes, usually okay: Swimming, Stationary Bike, Elliptical, Rowing Machine
    Shinsplints
    Yes, usually okay: Swimming
    Sometimes okay; let pain guide you: Stationary Bike
    No, usually not okay: Elliptical, Rowing Machine
    Stress Fracture
    Yes, usually okay: Swimming
    Sometimes okay; let pain guide you: Stationary Bike
    No, usually not okay: Elliptical, Rowing Machine
    Get Shoes That Fit

    Running shoes have changed a lot over the years. They breathe better, are more likely to come in various widths, and are constructed from superior materials. Most important, there are far more shoes to choose from (racing, training, track, cross-country). There are even minimalist shoes designed to mimic barefoot running (although there's no scientific evidence that forgoing shoes decreases injury risk). This gives you more options. Of course, you still have to figure out which shoe will work best for you—not an easy task. "There's no single best shoe for every runner," says J. D. Denton, who has owned a Fleet Feet running store in Davis, California, for 14 years. Not only that, but it's impossible to say that shoe ABC will eliminate injury XYZ. Denton and his staff are careful to draw a line between giving medical advice and suggesting a top-notch shoe. "We're careful not to say, 'This shoe will cure your plantar fasciitis,'" Denton says. "Shoes aren't designed to cure injuries. Our goal is to make sure you get the shoe that fits and functions best on your feet."

    Others are less cautious than Denton. They point out that while a given shoe isn't guaranteed to heal a given injury, the right shoe on the right runner can help. Verran says that he has been able to help patients overcome injuries by suggesting a better fit. "It happens all the time," Verran says. "It's a matter of finding the shoe that's right for a certain foot type."

    ACTION PLAN


    Don't expect shoes to correct an injury resulting from training error or muscular imbalance. However, when you need new shoes (replace them every 300 to 500 miles), go to a specialty store to get expert advice. As a general rule, buy less shoe rather than more shoe (unless you weigh 220 pounds or know you need the Monster Mash model). Studies show that shoes perform best when they fit best. Ask your shoe salesperson: "Why is this the best shoe for me?" If he or she can't provide a sound answer, find another store.

  4. #24

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    SPLIT FROM THIS THREAD (Too much off topic) https://whiteblaze.net/forum/show...=1#post1431990

    Quote Originally Posted by wcgornto View Post
    I can't say I agree with this. I don't run and won't run. I value my knees, hips and ankles very much and will not sacrifice them to the rigors of regular running. I will do intermittent running as part of a broader, Crossfit type exercise regimen, but I will not run regularly for its own sake.

    I believe a more accurate statement would be that some form of regular cardiovascular fitness training and strength training is essential for optimizing long term health, along with proper diet and nutrition. I don't believe there is consensus among the fitness experts that running is superior to other forms of exercise.
    I’m somewhat of a crossfit fan and other types of exercise; I did not intend to say that one should run and nothing else, I do a multitude of other things. However, to say that running, say a marathon or even ultra-running events are bad for the knees and other joints is just wrong. As long as you properly develop the joints thru sensible running and cross training it is no problem to run more than a mile or two.

    Seems like the crossfit world has this idea that running more than a 5K is a waste of time; not true at all, your joints get stronger with every mile past a 5K.

    I didn’t say running is superior to any other activity; try not to label things as “superior”. However, long-distance runs will get one in outstanding shape like nothing else will, probably because the body was designed to run. I don’t know what fitness experts you listen to, but here are just a few that speak of the benefits running. (Only copied excerpts from each reference)

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/he...well.html?_r=0

    "The scientific evidence supports the notion that humans evolved to be runners. In a 2007 paper in the journal Sports Medicine, Daniel E. Lieberman, a Harvard evolutionary biologist, and Dennis M. Bramble, a biologist at the University of Utah, wrote that several characteristics unique to humans suggested endurance running played an important role in our evolution.

    Most mammals can sprint faster than humans — having four legs gives them the advantage. But when it comes to long distances, humans can outrun almost any animal. Because we cool by sweating rather than panting, we can stay cool at speeds and distances that would overheat other animals. On a hot day, the two scientists wrote, a human could even outrun a horse in a 26.2-mile marathon.


    Why would evolution favor the distance runner? The prevailing theory is that endurance running allowed primitive humans to incorporate meat into their diet. They may have watched the sky for scavenging birds and then run long distances to reach a fresh kill and steal the meat from whatever animal was there first."




    http://sci.waikato.ac.nz/evolution/HumanEvolution.shtml

    "Another feature linked to bipedalism is the Achilles tendon, which in Homo links the calf muscles to the tarsal bones of the heel. The great apes lack this structure, and the calf muscle extends right down to the tarsal bones. The presence of the Achilles tendon in humans makes us relatively good endurance runners - a necessary feature for active hunting on the open savannah. The tendon acts as a spring, storing energy when it is stretched and releasing it again as the foot pushes off for the next stride (Bramble & Lieberman, 2004). This can save up to 50% of the metabolic energy costs of rapid locomotion."





    http://www.active.com/women/Articles...g-Myth-Busters

    Myth #1: Running is Bad for Your Knees

    "Dr. Jason Karp: People assume that because running requires pounding the ground, it must be damaging to your knees—but this myth is completely false. There's no research that shows a greater instance of joint issues or osteoarthritis in people who run versus those who do not. On the contrary, studies show that running can be beneficial for joints as it strengthens the surrounding musculature and increases bone density. "



  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedaling Fool View Post
    SPLIT FROM THIS THREAD (Too much off topic) https://whiteblaze.net/forum/show...=1#post1431990


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wcgornto
    "I can't say I agree with this. I don't run and won't run. I value my knees, hips and ankles very much and will not sacrifice them to the rigors of regular running. I will do intermittent running as part of a broader, Crossfit type exercise regimen, but I will not run regularly for its own sake.

    I believe a more accurate statement would be that some form of regular cardiovascular fitness training and strength training is essential for optimizing long term health, along with proper diet and nutrition. I don't believe there is consensus among the fitness experts that running is superior to other forms of exercise."





    I’m somewhat of a crossfit fan and other types of exercise; I did not intend to say that one should run and nothing else, I do a multitude of other things. However, to say that running, say a marathon or even ultra-running events are bad for the knees and other joints is just wrong. As long as you properly develop the joints thru sensible running and cross training it is no problem to run more than a mile or two.

    Seems like the crossfit world has this idea that running more than a 5K is a waste of time; not true at all, your joints get stronger with every mile past a 5K.

    I didn’t say running is superior to any other activity; try not to label things as “superior”. However, long-distance runs will get one in outstanding shape like nothing else will, probably because the body was designed to run. I don’t know what fitness experts you listen to, but here are just a few that speak of the benefits running. (Only copied excerpts from each reference)

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/he...well.html?_r=0

    "The scientific evidence supports the notion that humans evolved to be runners. In a 2007 paper in the journal Sports Medicine, Daniel E. Lieberman, a Harvard evolutionary biologist, and Dennis M. Bramble, a biologist at the University of Utah, wrote that several characteristics unique to humans suggested endurance running played an important role in our evolution.

    Most mammals can sprint faster than humans — having four legs gives them the advantage. But when it comes to long distances, humans can outrun almost any animal. Because we cool by sweating rather than panting, we can stay cool at speeds and distances that would overheat other animals. On a hot day, the two scientists wrote, a human could even outrun a horse in a 26.2-mile marathon.


    Why would evolution favor the distance runner? The prevailing theory is that endurance running allowed primitive humans to incorporate meat into their diet. They may have watched the sky for scavenging birds and then run long distances to reach a fresh kill and steal the meat from whatever animal was there first."




    http://sci.waikato.ac.nz/evolution/HumanEvolution.shtml

    "Another feature linked to bipedalism is the Achilles tendon, which in Homo links the calf muscles to the tarsal bones of the heel. The great apes lack this structure, and the calf muscle extends right down to the tarsal bones. The presence of the Achilles tendon in humans makes us relatively good endurance runners - a necessary feature for active hunting on the open savannah. The tendon acts as a spring, storing energy when it is stretched and releasing it again as the foot pushes off for the next stride (Bramble & Lieberman, 2004). This can save up to 50% of the metabolic energy costs of rapid locomotion."





    http://www.active.com/women/Articles...g-Myth-Busters

    Myth #1: Running is Bad for Your Knees

    "Dr. Jason Karp: People assume that because running requires pounding the ground, it must be damaging to your knees—but this myth is completely false. There's no research that shows a greater instance of joint issues or osteoarthritis in people who run versus those who do not. On the contrary, studies show that running can be beneficial for joints as it strengthens the surrounding musculature and increases bone density. "


    Just some more data on how the notion that the impact of running is damaging to your body is total myth; I believe this myth is primarily a result of the fitness industry, as crazy as that sounds. The big meme is that exercise must be low-impact The body needs stress to build up and there is no such thing as having a healthy body without having a fit body; diet alone will not prevent loss of bone mass as you age.


    http://yourlife.usatoday.com/fitness...ers/51049132/1



    Excerpt:

    Running can help boost bone density

    Stanford researchers called Joy Johnson back for a second reading on a bone density test recently because they couldn’t believe their eyes.

    “Their professor ran a race with me,’’ says Johnson. “He saw them looking at the results and told them, ‘The results are true. She has incredibly dense bones,’ he said.’’

    Pounding from running helps maintain bone density, according to Barbara Bushman, author of the American College of Sports Medicine’s Complete Guide to Fitness and Health. Johnson does not take any bone-strengthening supplements.

    Bushman says running also improves good cholesterol levels, muscle mass and oxygen-carrying capacity, making daily activities like carrying groceries easier, and enhances body composition by decreasing fat that can be a trigger for type 2 diabetes.

    “There is really no down side,’’ says Bushman. “Exercise also improves our mood. There’s that great aspect, too.” — Janice Lloyd

  6. #26
    Registered User FarmerChef's Avatar
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    I think I agree with what you're saying, PF. The only thing I'll add again is that the advent of the modern running shoe seemed to change the natural stride for many, especially once the raised heel was introduced into everyday casual shoes worn by children. This is not natural to the human body. What's natural is walking around barefoot. Our foot is wonderfully made to adapt to changing terrain both walking and running. But a typical sneaker with a high heel encourages the heel strike rather than midfoot strike. At least it did for me for a very long time. The switch to a flat shoe felt like a breath of fresh air. And my knees never feel like they take a pounding at all.

    Caveat: this is of course just my personal experience.
    2,000 miler. Still keepin' on keepin' on.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wise Old Owl View Post
    Persistence hunting is a hunting technique in which hunters use a combination of running and tracking to pursue prey to the point of exhaustion. While humans can sweat to reduce body heat, their quadrupedal prey would need to slow from a gallop in order to pant.[1] Today, it is very rare and seen only in a few groups such as Kalahari bushmen and the Tarahumara or Raramuri people of Northern Mexico. Persistence hunting requires endurance running – running many miles for extended periods of time. Among primates, endurance running is only seen in humans, and persistence hunting is thought to have been one of the earliest forms of human hunting, having evolved 2 million years ago.

    I do persistence hunting when my boxer dog gets out of the yard. he can run fast, but has no endurance. the main trick is to keep him moving, and not let him stop at a mud puddle to drink. I can usually exhaust him in about 15 minutes.
    Time is but the stream I go afishin' in.
    Thoreau

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by FarmerChef View Post
    I think I agree with what you're saying, PF. The only thing I'll add again is that the advent of the modern running shoe seemed to change the natural stride for many, especially once the raised heel was introduced into everyday casual shoes worn by children. This is not natural to the human body. What's natural is walking around barefoot. Our foot is wonderfully made to adapt to changing terrain both walking and running. But a typical sneaker with a high heel encourages the heel strike rather than midfoot strike. At least it did for me for a very long time. The switch to a flat shoe felt like a breath of fresh air. And my knees never feel like they take a pounding at all.

    Caveat: this is of course just my personal experience.
    Yeah everyone is different, but I'm kind of in between the minimalists and the shoe freaks. I only buy cheap shoes, nothing special, no more than $30 (and that's the high end; I've gotten them much cheaper)

    I also don't pay attention to mileage, run them until they fall apart. However, I do like to run barefoot on the beach, both in the hard-packed sand as well as the very soft stuff. And I have ran barefoot on pavement, not as bad as I thought it would be, but it does take a while to build up the skin.

    However, I was very surprised when I read a book by Jeff Galloway (forget which one), but in it he was very much against stretching, but especially stretching the achilles tendon area. Not only is he against it, he also recommends only running on very level surfaces and using heel lifts in your shoes (as if the heel isn't lifted enough) so as prevent the smallest downward movement of the heel so to not stretch the tendon

    I have respect for Jeff, but I disagree with his ideas of coddling the achilles tendon on so many levels.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wise Old Owl View Post
    Persistence hunting is a hunting technique in which hunters use a combination of running and tracking to pursue prey to the point of exhaustion. While humans can sweat to reduce body heat, their quadrupedal prey would need to slow from a gallop in order to pant.[1] Today, it is very rare and seen only in a few groups such as Kalahari bushmen and the Tarahumara or Raramuri people of Northern Mexico. Persistence hunting requires endurance running – running many miles for extended periods of time. Among primates, endurance running is only seen in humans, and persistence hunting is thought to have been one of the earliest forms of human hunting, having evolved 2 million years ago.
    Just a quick anecdote to show that some people still use persistence hunting techniques:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-24953910

    .Kenyans chase down and catch goat-killing cheetahs

    Four villagers in north-east Kenya have chased down and captured two cheetahs which were killing their goats.
    The owner of the goats told the BBC that the cheetahs had been picking off his animals one by one, day by day.
    The men waited until the hottest part of the day before launching the chase over a distance of four miles (6.4km).
    The cheetahs got so tired they could not run any more. The villagers captured them alive and handed them over to the Kenya Wildlife Service.
    "I need compensation from them because the cheetahs killed most of my goats," Nur Osman Hassan told the BBC's Somali Service.
    Correspondents say livestock is the backbone of the economy for the Kenyan-Somali community living in the arid north-east of Kenya.
    Cheetahs are the fastest-running animals on the planet and can reach speeds of at least 104km/h (64mph).
    'Daily kills'
    Mr Hassan, from a village near Wajir town, said the cheetahs were attacking his goat herd over several weeks.
    "These cheetahs killed 15 of my goats - they were coming to my house daily to kill my goats," he said.
    He said he decided to return to his village to organise their capture at a time of day when cheetahs get very tired and usually rest in shade.
    "I was sipping a cup of tea when I saw them killing another goat," he said, explaining that this was early in the morning.
    He said he waited until several hours later when the sun was high to go after them.
    "I called some youths and we ran after them," he said.

    "We caught them and we brought them to the local authorities.".
    Colorless green ideas sleep furiously.

  10. #30

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    There are several take-aways from that story. One being that it shows how fine a niche many animals fill, thus how the slightest disruption can be deadly.

    It's good to be a generalist, like us humans as opposed to having a super ability. It reminds me of triathletes that must balance their abilities, because no matter how good they are at one discipline they can't win with that alone. In other words the more they work on one area and become very good at, the more the other areas suffer.

    In the financial world they have a saying for this: Don't put all your eggs in one basket.

  11. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wise Old Owl View Post
    Persistence hunting is a hunting technique in which hunters use a combination of running and tracking to pursue prey to the point of exhaustion. While humans can sweat to reduce body heat, their quadrupedal prey would need to slow from a gallop in order to pant.[1] Today, it is very rare and seen only in a few groups such as Kalahari bushmen and the Tarahumara or Raramuri people of Northern Mexico. Persistence hunting requires endurance running – running many miles for extended periods of time. Among primates, endurance running is only seen in humans, and persistence hunting is thought to have been one of the earliest forms of human hunting, having evolved 2 million years ago.
    Here's an article on Persistence Hunting, pretty interesting: http://www.abc.net.au/science/articl...03/4015913.htm

    BTW, the coversion forumla to convert KPH to MPH is to multiply by 0.621, i.e. ...... KPH x 0.621 = _____ MPH.


    "For our size, we humans have the biggest brains in the animal kingdom, but physically we appear pretty mediocre.

    Surprisingly, it turns out that your average fit human can outrun a deer. In fact, a theory claims that we humans evolved the ability to be good endurance runners, so we could chase animals for hours, run them to a standstill, and kill them. The theory continues that their high-density protein and energy helped our brains evolve bigger and bigger.

    Back in 1978, Michael Baughman wrote an article in Sports Illustrated about how he outran a deer. The deer is more of a sprinter, than a marathon runner.

    On a warmish day (around 27°C) it took him about four hours to run down the deer over a distance of 24 kilometres, across the open range lands and orchards near his home. He got to within a few metres of the exhausted animal, talking quietly and soothingly, and then touched the deer's sweaty flank. Unlike our primeval ancestors, he let the deer escape.

    Michael could run down the deer just like his Indian Mohawk ancestors, not just because he could run a marathon in under three hours. There was also some basic biomechanical physiology involved.

    Let me introduce you to COT — the metabolic cost of transport. It's how much oxygen you have to breathe so you can shift a kilogram of body weight a distance of one kilometre. For most animals, it's a U-shaped curve. The bottom of the U is where you use the least amount of energy.

    A horse has three of these U-shaped overlapping curves. For walking, the most efficient speed is around 4.3 kilometres per hour; for trotting it's around 11.5 kilometres per hour; and galloping is most efficient at around 22.7 kilometres per hour. The horse will transition from walking to trotting to galloping at the points where these curves cross over.

    For humans, the most efficient walking speed is around 5.4 kilometres per hours. For speeds both slower and faster than 5.4 kilometres per hour we burn up more oxygen and energy to shift our weight over a given distance.

    But as our walking speed gets to around 8.3 kilometres per hour, we reach the point where the costs of transport curves for "walking" and "running" cross over.

    Above 8.3 kilometres per hour we actually burn less energy and oxygen by running instead of walking. The act of running uses what the physicists call a "mass-spring mechanism". Various tendons and ligaments in our legs act as springs to capture and store the elastic strain energy as our legs hit the ground. They then release this energy through recoil, when we push off onto the next step.

    How did we get to be such efficient long distance runners?

    It seems that the long process of evolution began with our ancient primate ancestors. We have found strong hints of these evolutionary changes in Homo habilis some 2.6 million years ago and in Homo erectus 1.8 million years ago.

    Endurance running posed four major demands: energetics, strength, stabilisation and thermoregulation.

    One issue in energetics is the "mass-spring mechanism". The main springs are the Achilles tendon and the longitudinal arch of the foot. In fact, the arch of the foot just by itself returns about 17 per cent of the energy captured in each step, when we run.

    The second factor needed for endurance running is a skeleton strengthened in a few critical areas. These changes include a shorter neck of the femur so that it doesn't bend so much when our foot slams into the ground.

    As compared to a four-legged animal, the act of running for a two legged animal is inherently unstable. The leg that is in contact with the ground generates enormous twisting forces as it pushes off. So we evolved features to enhance the stabilisation of our trunk, such as greatly enlarged muscles on the buttocks and on the spine. There are also changes in the neck and skull to enhance stabilisation of the head, while we run.

    Finally, we humans have a heat advantage over all the other primates, and most of the quadrupeds. We have a superior ability to get rid of the excess metabolic heat generated by running.
    We have less body hair, vastly increased numbers of sweat glands, and a narrow long body to radiate away the heat. Our very efficient mouth breathing gives us both higher airflow rates with lower muscular effort, as well as another way to dump excess heat.

    The theory is that we evolved endurance running to push our prey to exhaustion, and then kill and eat them.

    These days the furthest we have to chase our prey is the few steps to the fridge. If we had to resort to wearing out a deer to get our evening meal its likely most of us would run into trouble."

  12. #32

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    Wow, we really were born to run!

  13. #33
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    I don't need to re-learn how to run.
    I need to lose 40-50 pounds.

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