JMT: Shelter advice

[Dr. Professor]

Hi all,

My uncle and I are hiking the northern half of the JMT in mid-September (Happy Isles to Muir Trail Ranch). Due to time constraints, we'll do the southern half in a year or two. I'm torn on shelter options, so I'd appreciate some advice.

Here are the options:



A) Hammock:

Advantages -- I love my hammock; far more comfortable than sleeping on the ground.

Disadvantages -- While the northern half of the trail isn't as high as the southern half, I still could do some hiking above the tree line. Even where there are trees, they tend to be widely spaced with massive trunks that are not conducive to hanging.



B) Shelter System (specifically, this system: http://www.hyperlitemountaingear.com...ht-system.html but with an Echo I insert):

Advantages -- Flexibility; can cowboy with tarp, cowboy with tarp and beak, sleep with insert only, use all three, etc....

Disadvantages -- Need to be able to use stakes or this won't work; much of the JMT is rock.



C) Self-supporting tent (type not yet specified)

Advantage -- Can use this anywhere on the JMT.

Disadvantages -- Not as comfortable as hammock, not as flexible as shelter system, not nearly as good as the other options in the rain (not likely to be a big problem on the JMT).



Thoughts?

[Ron]

I did the JMT last year with a hexamid from Zpacks and it worked out fine. I don't believe a hammock would work well and you appear to know the limitations. I've spent a couple of nights in the HMG tent and it's outstanding, if the price isn't a factor that would be my choice. I didn't have any problems being able to use my stakes on the JMT, the existing campsites are generally not a problem from that aspect especially on the section you are planning to hike.
Ron

[Mountain Mike]

I did PCT which is close to or the same for a lot of that in late august. I tended to camp high up on passes for dramatic views & used a bivy. But lower down a hammock would be doable. Sept normally means more precip so I would use a better shelter than I did. Bug non existent. There are enough place to hang or pitch a tent. You will love the trail!

[lvnv1212]

I hiked the JMT late Aug / early Sept last year and also used a hexamid from Zpacks. Next time...I will use my Warbonnet traveler with HammockGear Cuben fiber hex hammock tarp. It may vary by year, but I didn't see one mosquito.

[fiddlehead]

I don't see the problem with using stakes on the JMT.
Sure there are rocks, but there is also dirt.
I'd go with whatever you are most comfortable with.
I've done that trail with different shelters including a Mega-mid, Integral designs sil-shelter, and nothing. (slept out under the stars, got rained on once, covered up with a piece of tyvek)
But, I would advise against the hammock as trees can be sparse and far apart and you are then limiting yourself to where you can camp.
I tend to camp where people don't.

[Miner]

I often do trips to the Sierra Nevada which included doing the JMT/PCT. For years, I normally just cowboy camp with a bivy for bug protection. A small tarp comes along incase of rain. I found that camping above tree line meant that I often didn't have to deal with bugs at night.

If you really want to use the hammock, there are plenty of trees down in the valleys between the passes. However, that is also where most of the bugs and bears are. But depending on your daily mileage, you may find yourself still camping above tree line at least once or twice.

[Dr. Professor]

Thanks to all of you -- especially Ron; it's not every day you elicit post #4 from a guy who's been around since '05.

Based on your responses, I'll go with the shelter system. That should offer plenty of flexibility as you all say that stakes won't be a problem. One of the things I like about hammocking on the AT is that I can camp pretty much anywhere. For the JMT, the opposite would be true. So I'll go to ground, but with the flexibility that the shelter system provides.

Thanks again.

[BrianLe]

If you're starting the JMT in mid-September, I suggest a simple tarp, and that hopefully many (most?) nights you won't even bother putting it up. My wife and I hiked the JMT this past September and she wanted a tent, so I carried that and put it up each night, but we could have cowboy camped all along the way. Of course YMMV, so bring the tarp but --- that's certainly all you need IMO.

I'm actually a bit mixed on the hammock option. It's true that you spend a lot of time above treeline on the trail, but the smart call IMO is in general to "walk high but camp low". A tent or tarp does give you the flexibility to sleep higher if you want to, but I think we slept down in trees every day, and there were a couple of times where campsite options were pretty limited in the vicinity we wanted to be --- say, near a particular lake. For those cases a hammock would be nice. Caveat: only if everyone else you're hiking with is also using a hammock. And only if you're willing to go to ground if needed.

[flemdawg1]

Don't hammock tarps work on the ground? Is so take a self-inflator pad instead of an underquilt, and simply use the tarp on the ground when you need to.

[q-tip]

I am hiking the JMT this Aug. using a Tarptent Contrail (used 1,100 mi AT). The Contrail weighs 1.5 oz. less, has about the same dimensions and is $300 less expensive.

[Dr. Professor]

I've thought about the idea of hammocking with a pad instead of a UQ, going to ground where necessary. I have a double layer blackbird, so the pad would work decently. I've never used my hammock tarp in that manner, but I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work in the manner that, say, the echo II tarp does (maybe not quite as wind ready as a tarp specifically designed for ground camping, but I would think it would work).

I guess one VERY critical question is: can I count on no bugs in September on the JMT. I know they usually aren't there that time of year, but has anybody had any bad experiences with bugs in September in the High Sierra?

Overall, I'd guess that hammock with pad going to ground and tarp as necessary would work well provided no bugs and no big storms.

I'm hiking with my uncle; he has a hammock and likes it for the AT but will probably tent the JMT. He should be able to camp wherever I can (on the JMT), so no limitation there. I agree that camping low is preferable in colder weather, but I don't want my gear to dictate where we camp. I want a gear situation that will adapt to wherever we choose to camp.

[Miner]

I"ve never noticed bugs in September in the High Sierra. However, I was snowed on once on Sept.19, but it melted off in 1-1.5 days. The only real downside to hiking in September is how cold the nights are (low 20's is pretty common in the higher elevations). If there are any bugs still alive in September, they won't be active at night when its that cold.

[Dr. Professor]

That's another thing: I use a quilt rather than a bag in my hammock; bags are a pain in a hammock. I guess I'd have to take a bag and unzip it in the hammock but zip it when going to ground.... Lots to ponder.

Some people think there's no one correct way to hike. I'm sort of the opposite; I think that for each individual, there is a correct way for any given set of conditions. The problem is, I'm not sure what the correct way for me is going to be in this particular set of conditions.

Perhaps the shelter system I described above would be the best way to go. It certainly seems to provide more reliable flexibility than the other options. Of course, if bugs aren't going to be a problem, I could just use the Echo II tarp and zpacks solo plus cuben ground sheet: http://zpacks.com/shelter/cuben_groundsheet.shtml

Actually, that last option could be really sweet.

[flemdawg1]

That's another thing: I use a quilt rather than a bag in my hammock; bags are a pain in a hammock. I guess I'd have to take a bag and unzip it in the hammock but zip it when going to ground.... Lots to ponder.

Actually, that last option could be really sweet.

Quilts work on the ground too.

[Dr. Professor]

Quilts work on the ground too.

Interesting; I've never tried it. I always assumed that I'd roll out of a quilt on the ground whereas a hammock helps to keep it in place.

To tell the truth, this has been a fun mental exercise for me; since buying my hammock, I've only ever gone back to ground to camp in a tent with my four-year-old. Now that I'm really looking into the very different reality of hiking in the high sierra, I'm really starting to look at gear in a whole new way.

Does anybody think cuben groundcloth + cuben tarp + 20 degree quilt + sleeping pad (no bug protection) would be a bad idea for the JMT in September? I'm a little leary of the quilt option when the temps could (and likely will) drop into the twenties.

[Mountain Mike]

Interesting; I've never tried it. I always assumed that I'd roll out of a quilt on the ground whereas a hammock helps to keep it in place.

To tell the truth, this has been a fun mental exercise for me; since buying my hammock, I've only ever gone back to ground to camp in a tent with my four-year-old. Now that I'm really looking into the very different reality of hiking in the high sierra, I'm really starting to look at gear in a whole new way.

Does anybody think cuben groundcloth + cuben tarp + 20 degree quilt + sleeping pad (no bug protection) would be a bad idea for the JMT in September? I'm a little leary of the quilt option when the temps could (and likely will) drop into the twenties.

In 98 doing the PCT from Donner Pass & out at Whitney I ditched the tent once my girlfriend had to go back home/work & just carried a bivy. Late Aug-Early Sept. I often slept high & would do the same again. hiking 200.jpgBugs weren't a bother. I would probably suggest a tyveck ground cloth though

[Dr. Professor]

Regarding the ground cloth, what about something like this: http://gossamergear.com/shelters/pol...ampaign=venpop

[Mountain Mike]

Looks like an option. My only concern about using Cuben was the cost of something that is likely to get punctured.

[Miner]

Does anybody think cuben groundcloth + cuben tarp + 20 degree quilt + sleeping pad (no bug protection) would be a bad idea for the JMT in September? I'm a little leary of the quilt option when the temps could (and likely will) drop into the twenties.

Thats pretty much how I do it, 20F quilt & small cuben fiber tarp. Only I use a GG polycro sheet as a ground cloth (its lighter). Though I often add a 6oz water resistant bivy sack.

[Dr. Professor]

Thanks for your help Mike (and everyone).

Based in no small part on the advice in this thread, I'll probably use the Echo II tarp (but not the whole shelter system) and the gossamer gear ground cloth. I probably will go ahead and pick up a new sleeping bag though.