Triple crown hike, starting date

[Scandinavian]

Hi,
new to the forum, but o'boy is there a lot of good information here!

I'm currently planning a triple crown hike (AT, CDT, PCT). As of right now it looks like I'll be off work in oct. How feasable of a starting date is mid oct.? I wouldn't mind doing some flip-flopping to avoid the worst weather/snow conditions, but I would like to minimalize it. Thanks for any feedback!

[Malto]

Before the normal flames start I would suggest providing a bit more information like:
1) experience level.
2) is there a time constraint for completion, ie year.
3) what mileage can you do right at the start on normal trail conditions.

Depending on the answers the answer to how feasible could range from nearly impossible to problematic. Heading south bound on the AT would make the most sense but you would have to be a world class hiker to have a shot of getting out of new England before Nast weather sets in. What is world class..... Here is what a mid October AT start looks like and the type of hiker that can successfully pull it off.

[Sly]

As Malto suggest, mid-October the AT southbound is your only realistic option. However after that the PCT and CDT will be nearly impossible to finish.

If you can cover each trail in somewhat less than three months each , I suggest staring the PCT (north) in May, CDT (south) in late-July and the AT (south) in mid-October.

You'll have to maintain about a 35 mile per day average.

[Almost There]

Agree with the others, and I'd add, most importantly, how long do you have to hike? Do you have to finish in a year's time, or can you stretch that out?

[Malto]

Oops... http://www.thehikinglife.com/journal/2012/10/page/2/

Fast southbound AT hike starting mid October.

[Scandinavian]

Thanks for the response!

I'm terribly sorry I didn't add more context in my first post. As for experience I'd be in the "fairly experienced"-category (having completed two 1750 miles hikes before, and I have quite a bit wilderness experience). As for time constraints: not really, but as I know myself I'd push to complete in under a year (considering that this seems to be the norm). Daily averages in the start I'm assuming is gonna be around 30 - (with the previous hikes being harder and completed with slightly lower averages)

[takethisbread]

Even a mid October start in Baxter is quite difficult. A fast hiker would still likely encounter a bit of trouble getting through Maine and the Whites without serious conditions. A fast hiker might clear the Whites in a month and a half if all goes very well at that time of year. You'll be hauling a lot of gear. Once you clear that, it's gonna be fine , although cold and snow will be ever present. U are experienced so u know what u might be getting into, so good luck!

[Malto]

Thanks for the response!

I'm terribly sorry I didn't add more context in my first post. As for experience I'd be in the "fairly experienced"-category (having completed two 1750 miles hikes before, and I have quite a bit wilderness experience). As for time constraints: not really, but as I know myself I'd push to complete in under a year (considering that this seems to be the norm). Daily averages in the start I'm assuming is gonna be around 30 - (with the previous hikes being harder and completed with slightly lower averages)

In respect to your comment that "I'd push to complete in under a year (considering that this seems to be the norm)"

Are you looking to do all three trails (AT,PCT,CDT) in a year or just a single trail? The reason I ask is that there have only been 4 people that I know of that have hiked all three trails in a twelve month period, not only is it not the norm but it is highly unusual. Also, you will have to do well over 30 a day to hike all three in a year, Folks that have accomplished hike 40+ miles per day on a huge stretch of the trails.

[Scandinavian]

Solid advice. I'll be frank, I haven't done a whole lot of research, but the general opinion seems to be that I should start a AT SB, because of snow issues. How about flip-flopping?

And what is serious conditions?

gg-man: Forgive my math, but AFAIK all three trails has a total length of about 7,700 miles, which means you'd have to average about 22 miles -am I wrong?

[takethisbread]

Perhaps do the research. The serious conditions can be right away . U may have to wait several days to climb Kathadin to start. I'm guessing your actual trail average will have to be 30 mpd given travel and re supply issues. Quite a few people every year come on wb claiming to make some incredible hike, and like someone said 4 people have actually done it in history, I imagine all of them had a real good idea what they were in for (except that last guy , who was unknowingly smashing records!)
Good luck

[Malto]

Solid advice. I'll be frank, I haven't done a whole lot of research, but the general opinion seems to be that I should start a AT SB, because of snow issues. How about flip-flopping?

And what is serious conditions?

gg-man: Forgive my math, but AFAIK all three trails has a total length of about 7,700 miles, which means you'd have to average about 22 miles -am I wrong?

Yes you are wrong. Here's why. Ignore the AT, southern CDT and southern PCT. The focus needs to be on the northern 2/3rds of the PCT and CDT. Let's assume you head north on the PCT then south on the CDT. It is roughly 4000 Miles between Kennedy Meadows on the pct and the CO/NM border south bound on the CDT? You have a window of approximately June 1st until October 15th give or take a couple of weeks either way due to snow conditions. So you have 150 days to do those miles. On just a pure average that puts you at 26+ miles per day. But in order to average that you need to make up for lost time in the Sierra, travel time between trails and getting ahead to maximize you chances of making it through CO due to weather. Another factor is the potential of heavy snow in the north on either the PCT or CDT which isn't a show stopper but it can be a schedule slipper. If I was planning this I would target a June 1st to October 1st window for this critical section. That is about a 35mpd average and I would take few zeros beyond what was needed to travel between trails. I would plan to do 40 mile days consistently whenever possible.

As far as the rest of the trail. If you head south on the AT in October you will need to fly. Once out of new England you can throttle it back and cruise to Springer. Then head to either the CDT and hike to the CO border. Head out to the PCT and head north. Your pace on the second half of the AT until Kennedy meadows can be somewhat relaxed. Assuming a normal snow year, it doesn't help you much to get there much before June 1st.

Take a look at Swami's journal. His pace was pretty close to Squeakies and Flyin Brian's. Trauma had to be in that range as well. you can find Sqeakys and Flyin Brian's journal on the web as well. Flyin Brian's will give you a good feel on worst case scenario on the Northern AT.

[Squeaky 2]

you will have to average over 40 miles a day to make up for resupply and bad weather/trail conditions. maine and new england can be fine one day and be nailed in snow the next. to give youy an idea i was hit by one storm and it slowed me down by 3-4 weeks! thats no joke either. when you are in mahoosacs and whites in these conditions even the very fittest hikers will struggle to average much more than 10 miles per day. i was not far off 200 days for the triple crown until that storm!!!
south of there its doable to average 40 a day even with bad weather but you will leave yourself with no where to go out west early in the year. early season sierras are amazing but again very tough in heavy snow years. streams are dangerous to cross and passes are hard to climb with corniced snow right the way over the top. avelanches are another danger. there is also alot of lakes that may be snowed over. study maps to avoid hiking into the middle of these!!!

Trauma started further north on november 1st at cape gaspe and headed south but make no mistake he is with out doubt the most experienced and accomplished hiker you will meet but none the less its doable!!

it may be that a spring start nourth bound out west would suit better for weather conditions

[Marta]

On the positive side, as a Scandinavian you are probably way ahead of the game in terms of snow travel and judging snow conditions. Whether you can do it as fast as you'd like is another matter. Some of that will depend on the weather, which is beyond your control.

[Slo-go'en]

The weather is the wild card. Maybe it will break in your favor, but probably not. With good timing, doing two of the trails in one go would have a much better chance then all three. Forest fires out west could also mess you up.

[Mountain Mike]

Something to look at http://parkaymaps.110mb.com/combined...ilesIndex.html

[Scandinavian]

I'm flabbergasted by the well thought out arguments and considerations you all have - thank you very much.

And yes, I will do this my way - it will be my research and my plan that lays the basis of the trip, but your input is well received. I will update this thread as I go (if that is allright), whether it be more questions, stating my progress, or bouncing ideas around.

Much appreciated!

[HeartFire]

http://www.thehikinglife.com/

[fiddlehead]

What you want to do is do-able.
But you'll need some luck with the weather and snow in the Sierras and CO.
We started our attempt on Oct 14th 2001 from Baxter SOBO.
Finished the AT on Feb 13th.
Had snow here and there but nothing too bad. (breathed a sigh of relief once we got over and past the whites)

We hit our problems at the CO border NOBO on the CDT.
Tons of snow and travel was too slow.
So we headed over the PCT and hiked up to Kennedy MEadows.
Problem there is there was no road crossings for the next 500 miles. (Carson pass)
So, we headed back to CO and basically finished the CDT NOBO.

Then we had some family problems and had to take 21 days off.
Once we got back we tried but our hearts weren't in it.
We had a schedule and were only 1 day behind it when we took the 21 days off or I believe we would've been successful.
You can read all about it here: (AT portion anyway)
http://fiddlehead.wordpress.com/2010...empt-20012002/

Also, I believe our website is still up and running at triplecrownoneyear.tripod.com or something like that.
Complete with pictures and logs from the whole thing.
We also made a video which we still sell some copies once in a while.
They are available here if interested: http://warmstuff.com/product_info.ph...roducts_id=251

It can be done. IMO

[Terry7]

Something to look at http://parkaymaps.110mb.com/combined...ilesIndex.html

Cool link.

[Scandinavian]

How is the availibility for freeze dried food (MountainHouse, etc?) in typical resupply towns? I have tried the no-cook option, and it simply doesn't do it for me. I'm assuming this isn't an issue for the AT, but how about the PCT and CDT?

Yet again, thanks a lot for the great replies!