Kids, long-distance backpacking, and balancing freedom and safety

[CB1821]

My 13 year-old son and I will be making his first long-distance hiking trip on the AT through parts of GA and NC at the end of the month. Like most backpackers we have different hiking styles and speeds, so I don’t want to keep him confined to staying within his “dad’s line of sight” for the eight days we will be out there. We will, of course, camp together each night.
I could not ask for a better son, as he is mature, thoughtful, and well adjusted (despite having me as his dad and role model ) But… he is still only 13, and I (and his mom) worry about his safety on the trail during those times we will be hiking apart.
I’d be interested in hearing from other hiking parents on where their comfort level is on this and what rules, strategies, and/or technological options (like SPOT) were used to achieve it.

[Alligator]

I've brought along walkie talkies in the past in case we get separated. Show him how to turn it on and what channel it should be on.

If he hikes too fast give him some more gear to carry.

[Alligator]

I'll add, make sure he has everything needed to emergency overnight, warm clothes, rain gear, food and water, even a lighter and knife. Make sure he knows what to do if that happens. Make it clear what he should do if he is lost: don't leave the trail, stay put, three whistles or shouts for needing help. Go over the map with him and teach him some map skills. Set some rules for being out of sight like timed rest breaks, maybe have him wear a watch so he understands the time. Set stop points.

[daddytwosticks]

Set up "meeting points" to get together during the day. Like meet at ABC creek up the trail in three miles for a Snickers break. As others said, make sure he can use a map and have basic navigation skills.

[rocketsocks]

Excellent advise Alligator, I also like this rule of thumb when one finds they are "mis placed"...it's called.....STOP

Stop....oh man this don't look familiar...
Think....where the heck am I
Observe....yep yep I'm lost (mis-placed)
Plan....what the heck am I gonna do now

it's just one that always stuck with me.


to white blaze, enjoy learning and hiking with your son.

[hikerboy57]

i had the great pleasure of hiking with sassafras and kaboose off and on for the past 6 weeks. sassafras is a 13 year old hiking with her dad, kaboose, back home to maine.theyre both having a great time and you can see some great videos theyve been posting here:http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...ru-Hike-Videos

[FarmerChef]

My kids are all experienced hikers and exercise the tips that Alligator mentions. They are 12, 10 and 7. They know to wait for me and my wife at trail crossings (though I trust them to know which blazes to follow, at least the older two, the 7 year old might not look up often enough to check ) and any other intersection where they and us might get separated. +1 on Ali's advice to have set stop points and to make sure he has enough survival gear to make it ok if you get separated. There are times when blazes are indistinct or the trail can seem confusing if you're still new to it. After awhile, anticipating what trail maintainers were thinking when they did something becomes second nature and the mistakes get far less frequent. I might recommend that you start out together and let your son lead to demonstrate his confidence with the trail and orienteering. Then quickly let out the line a bit until you're comfortable being apart for several hours at a time. Either way, make sure you and he agree on a couple spots to meet during the day and again at night. Most of all, of course, have fun and enjoy the time together!

[Dogwood]

Wow, sensible people with sensible questions and other people with sensible answers. The world hasn't gone crazy!

[CB1821]

Thanks for the suggestions and ideas andd welcome. I think we will go with the advise on the walkie talkies, as he is used to using those on the farm (not sure why I had not considered that). I have incorperated your other advise into some thoughts I had been considering in the following:

Rules for each of us
1. Each morning before we start hiking for the day – set agreed upon meeting points and go over the trail route, trail/road crossings, and landmarks together.
2. Always stop to meet up ½ mile prior to any road crossing so we can hike together.
3. If confused/”misplaced” (and if the STOP rule of thumb fails to change this status to “un-lost” ) contact other on Walkie Talkie. If unable to make contact - stay put and use whistle. If there is cell phone reception, call other.
4. If either of us has missed a meeting place or is lost and cannot contact the other by walkie talkie or whistle, call home if there is cell phone coverage.
5. If you are in the lead and are not sure of the correct trail to take at intersections (or you think the other person might be confused at that same point), stop and wait for the other to catch up
6. Under no circumstances let your backpack (i.e., what you need for survival) out of sight
Things to emphasize to my son
1. Talking to other hikers is all part of the experience, but don’t give out hiking/camping plans or personal information, and sometimes it might be good to work it into any conversation that you are hiking with family and they will be along shortly.
2. Trust your instincts. If something does not feel right, move on (then call Dad).
3. Know the contact channel we will talk on (put it on the walkie talkie)

We each keep the following equipment:
1. Whistle
2. Motorola MT350 FRS walkie talkie (it had good reviews/features [has wather channels/alerts and uses AAA batteries] when I looked on lone just now).
3. Bear Spray canister (mom’s requirement )
4. All equipment necessary for survival
5. Map and Compass!
6. Cell phone (doubles as watch for keeping track of time)

Thanks, CB

[Alligator]

That's a good list CB, #2 (road) is a good point. Personally I would say that the bear spray is unnecessary however he might run into a stray/unleashed dog. A talk about how to handle aggressive dogs would be useful if he is not familiar with actions to take.

[CB1821]

That's a good list CB, #2 (road) is a good point. Personally I would say that the bear spray is unnecessary however he might run into a stray/unleashed dog. A talk about how to handle aggressive dogs would be useful if he is not familiar with actions to take. Alligator

Good Point. Unfortunately I have had a few close calls with agressive dogs on the trail (although the vast majority, along with their owners, have been well behaved) and we have talked about it. He has also been witness to the loss of some of our livestock at the hands of semi feral dogs, so he knows what they can do. If hiking poles don't stop agressive dogs, then the bear spray might indeed come in handy.

[illabelle]

Hmmmm. My husband and I always hike together. I have a different perspective. There are advantages to hiking solo, I'm sure, but we'd have to pack differently - two shelters, two food bags, two of almost everything. There are advantages to hiking with others:

1. We don't have to contort our arms into pretzels or take off our packs to get to our water bottles. He gets mine; I get his.
2. Likewise for minor things like stuffing a hat into the top zipper, or getting the maps from their side pocket, or tucking an unnecessary layer into a strap somewhere.
3. It's not necessary for each of us to carry all the ten essentials. Together we have what we need. One trowel. One stove. One tent.
4. All of our food smells (for the most part) are confined to one pack - mine, reducing the likelihood of rodents visiting his pack. If we separated, he'd need to carry some food, and we'd have two packs to protect more vigilantly.
5. We use a water filter. If we find a water source, both of us can fill up.
6. If one of us (me, of course) needs a boost up over a big rock, he's right there.
7. If one of us becomes injured or ill or tired, and needs to stop, slow down, or turn around, the other one knows, and the adjustment is made.
8. If one of us goes off trail to dig a hole, or investigate a funny-looking tree, the other knows. No wondering later at a rendezvous point, where is he/she? is he ahead of me or behind? should I stay here and wait, or should I go on? is this the really the place we were supposed to meet?
9. One of the reasons for backpacking in the first place is to spend time together. So we do.

Seems to me if you're backpacking "together," but you're actually separated most of the time while walking, you'll have to pack like solos, you'll forfeit some of the freedoms of hiking solo, you'll both have to cover the same ground each day to camp together, but you'll miss most of the advantages listed above. Am I wrong?

[FarmerChef]

Hmmmm. My husband and I always hike together. I have a different perspective. There are advantages to hiking solo, I'm sure, but we'd have to pack differently - two shelters, two food bags, two of almost everything. There are advantages to hiking with others:

1. We don't have to contort our arms into pretzels or take off our packs to get to our water bottles. He gets mine; I get his.
2. Likewise for minor things like stuffing a hat into the top zipper, or getting the maps from their side pocket, or tucking an unnecessary layer into a strap somewhere.
3. It's not necessary for each of us to carry all the ten essentials. Together we have what we need. One trowel. One stove. One tent.
4. All of our food smells (for the most part) are confined to one pack - mine, reducing the likelihood of rodents visiting his pack. If we separated, he'd need to carry some food, and we'd have two packs to protect more vigilantly.
5. We use a water filter. If we find a water source, both of us can fill up.
6. If one of us (me, of course) needs a boost up over a big rock, he's right there.
7. If one of us becomes injured or ill or tired, and needs to stop, slow down, or turn around, the other one knows, and the adjustment is made.
8. If one of us goes off trail to dig a hole, or investigate a funny-looking tree, the other knows. No wondering later at a rendezvous point, where is he/she? is he ahead of me or behind? should I stay here and wait, or should I go on? is this the really the place we were supposed to meet?
9. One of the reasons for backpacking in the first place is to spend time together. So we do.

Seems to me if you're backpacking "together," but you're actually separated most of the time while walking, you'll have to pack like solos, you'll forfeit some of the freedoms of hiking solo, you'll both have to cover the same ground each day to camp together, but you'll miss most of the advantages listed above. Am I wrong?

Yours is a good perspective, Illabelle and good points all around. It's exactly how my wife and I hike as we enjoy the time together and share the load. We get each others water or snacks so we don't have to take off our packs, wait for each other with their pack at restrooms, and so on. Our kids, however, enjoy stretching their legs a bit and enjoying some freedom by beating mom and dad down the trail. It's really fun to see them get lost in conversation together and we purposefully slow down a bit so we can talk privately as well. That's ok too. In reality, they don't carry all the gear they'd need if they got lost or separated but that's why we keep them within line of site or earshot at all times and they have to stop at the next intersection (not just roads) and wait for us before continuing. In the OPs case, his son might want to go a bit further afield and I think (though I can't speak from experience) that his son will still enjoy the sense of freedom and responsibility that comes with hiking solo even if it's only for a few hours each day. At that age, he's just yearning for a bit more freedom and a sense of being in charge of his own destiny. The trail can provide a safe, contained way of doing that if he follows the rules that his dad posted above.

[illabelle]

Farmer, I see your point. Our teen daughter hikes with us sometimes, and we stay together. But if we had more than one, I'm sure they'd want some distance between us and them.

Now that I think about it, we were on a trip over New Years with four teens (our daughter and three guys). The temperature was colder and the snow was deeper than we had prepared for, and progress was very slow. One boy in particular, ill-equipped and out of shape, struggled a lot. He and I were the slowest, so we set the pace, and we stayed together most of the time. Later, seeing his exhaustion, my husband and the strongest of the boys took off ahead of us to reach the shelter, with the intent to drop their packs, and come back to assist - although it didn't work out that way (we were closer than we thought). IF the weather had been more agreeable, and IF we'd had more confidence in the boys' experience level, I think we would have allowed the teens to go on ahead.

[bigcranky]

The walkie-talkies are going to have very spotty reception in the mountains. Enough so that I wouldn't carry them -- I think I'd just be frustrated when they don't work.

Having specific places to stop and meet is crucial, as I know how easy it is to become separated from my hiking partner and not be sure if he's ahead of me or behind me.

That said, about 10 years ago I was at Kincora for the night and ran into a guy who was hiking with his two kids. His daughter, maybe 15 or 16, was hiking with him. His son, maybe 13 or 14, was (if memory serves) a full day ahead of them, hiking with a group of thru-hikers. I met the son first, as I was heading sobo, and he seemed to have his head on straight, and dad seemed happy to give him some space to grow up in what is actually a pretty safe environment. IIRC they were going to meet in Damascus at the end of their section. I may have the ages slightly off, but I remember being impressed with all three of them. Wish I could remember the guy's name.

I'm not recommending this for you, of course. But it's useful to know that the trail is pretty safe. Have a great time.

[MuddyWaters]

My son would rather stare at my a$$ than carry the weight of a walkie talkie.

We alternate who leads.
We hike the same pace, because we are carrying nearly the same gear and loads. If anything his is lighter than mine by a bit.
But we always stay together. Even going to get water, etc.

[weary]

I walked all of Maine 20+ years ago with a slightly spoiled grandson (he had been raised by a single mother, mostly in a households of single women). We started in Grafton Notch and ended on the logging road south of Baxter Park in a giant rain storm. I let him set the pace. He complained greatly, but chatted with thru hikers, and as near as I could tell, he had a great time, and remembers the hike as an exciting and great turning point in his life. I found the same. Two years later I went to Georgia and walked home to Maine, using the confidence and knowledge I obtained with my grandson, who later joined me at Harpers Ferry, and quit near Vermont because his mother thought school might also be important.

Anyway, I quickly realized I could not keep him on a regular schedule. I could slow down to meet the delays created by his curiosity, but I could not keep up with his urge to keep ahead of my 62-year-old body. Time and again I would find him sleeping at the edge of the trail after not seeing him for an hour or two. I was worried at first. But in the end I thought it important to allow his independence, despite the minor risks involved.

[Malto]

On my thru hike I hike with another hiker for about half the trail. Twice we got separated at night, once due to me taking a wrong turn and he went the right way. He walked over 40 miles that day trying to catch up to me. The second time the hiker I was with pulled slightly off trail to camp and I walked right by. I camped about a mile later when I could see that there were no footprints in the snow so I stopped. Bottom line, things may happen. Some of the ideas listed in this thread address this. I personally wouldn't seperate out even with my youngest who is 15. I'm out there to spend time with him, I can hike solo anytime. Also, my oldest was great at staying a very consistent distance behind me regardless of my pace. It may have been my gas but I suspect he just zoned out while hiking.

[CB1821]

I agree the safest thing to do is hike together, as was pointed out, if you know for sure you will always be at the same place and at the same time on the trail. And under those circumstances you might not feel compelled have to have or duplicate some items (walkie talkies, extra compass/map, more than one phone, etc…) so there is the benefit in weight savings. And, of course, you always have a companion to talk to. All good points.

And we did follow this advice (always hiked together) over the last several years as we moved from day hikes to overnight backpacking trips. But with him having moved into the teen years, I now have become keenly aware of his “ yearning for a bit more freedom and a sense of being in charge of his own destiny” ,as FarmerChef so put it so aptly – and it is as it should be.

Of course the fact that I just moved over the half century mark in age (and hike like it) and we also are both introverts (in the Myers-Briggs sense) and enjoy/need some “quiet time” each day may have played a role, if only at an unconscious level, in me being willing to grant him more freedom And with arranged stops, lunch together, and meeting up prior to road crossings, I suspect we will not be much more than a mile apart at any given time.

After saying all this and with he and I talking about and agreeing on our “rules”, now watch us end up hiking together the whole time

I will add that along with him knowing he has more freedom/independence to explore (and responsibility), we will both be “hanging” for the first time – Warbonnet Blackbird 1.1 and edge tarps. That should make things all the more interesting.

[BillyGr]

2. Always stop to meet up ½ mile prior to any road crossing so we can hike together.

While I'm guessing the reason for this (in case there might be someone at the road that would cause harm) makes sense, it might be a bit hard to do, unless there is some other landmark (shelter, trail, creek) listed just prior to the road.
Perhaps it would be easier to say that when you can see a road ahead stop and meet up (in other words, making sure to stop far enough in so as to still be hidden in the trees, but not a specific distance)?
Also, one thing we often do with a group is to just meet at each landmark or trail junction (depending on how many are in a given area). Of course in that case the teenagers are still hiking in at least pairs, which lowers the getting lost issue.