Great place to make a bonfire :(

[Slo-go'en]

So, I came upon this today while doing a litte walk. Someone built a nice big fire, right smack in the middle of the Fallsway trail, maybe 20 feet from where it joins the Valleyway (which is the direct route up to Madison Hut). The thing which really makes me mad is they didn't even try to hide the fact they did this.

SAM_0548.jpg

[Tom Murphy]

fairly close to the road

[Sarcasm the elf]

Reminds me of that line by Bill Bryson:

I have long known that it is part of God's plan for me to spend a little time with each of the most stupid people on earth.

[Starchild]

I really don't understand the mentality of the OP. The location you describe is not a endangered environment and only has high usage because of AMC and their continuing ability to convince the forest service, among other things, that it is environmentally sound policy to fly in woodchips into the woods by helicopter.

We have human markings all along the trail, first the trail itself, then the blazes, then the leantos and signs, not to mention the environmental disasters of the huts. The trail is littered with evidence of humans where there. Humans sometimes camp and sometimes enjoy a fire, sometimes a celebratory bonfire - we are human that's what we do. There was a good time here, I am happy for them.

Unless you are bound up in rules and regulations, which are hypocritical - as pointed out above, not only live and let live but be happy that people had fun, but at the very least be consistent.

[Last Call]

At least I don't see any tin cans or beer bottles in the debris.....that's what I never can figure is why idiots try to burn those!

[hikerboy57]

I really don't understand the mentality of the OP. The location you describe is not a endangered environment and only has high usage because of AMC and their continuing ability to convince the forest service, among other things, that it is environmentally sound policy to fly in woodchips into the woods by helicopter.

We have human markings all along the trail, first the trail itself, then the blazes, then the leantos and signs, not to mention the environmental disasters of the huts. The trail is littered with evidence of humans where there. Humans sometimes camp and sometimes enjoy a fire, sometimes a celebratory bonfire - we are human that's what we do. There was a good time here, I am happy for them.

Unless you are bound up in rules and regulations, which are hypocritical - as pointed out above, not only live and let live but be happy that people had fun, but at the very least be consistent.

the amc doesnt set the rules for fires.

[Sarcasm the elf]

the amc doesnt set the rules for fires.

Nor do we need the AMC to tell us that irresponsibly creating a new firepit on a busy trail without making any effort to clean it up is a real jackass move.

[hikerboy57]

Nor do we need the AMC to tell us that irresponsibly creating a new firepit on a busy trail without making any effort to clean it up is a real jackass move.

i was trying to be nice

[Umlaut Von Fluffbutt]

I have no issues with fires, but I do have an issue of people cleaning up afterward. It only takes a couple of minutes to scatter everything. It's just the considerable thing to do.

[The Cleaner]

You can tell by the left over wood, might have been green trees cut down .I like to have fires but I keep them small and use only dead & dry wood for a hot fire. When done nothing left but ashes which can be scattered if not in a well used fire pit. Why would someone want a huge fire in warm weather? Some hikers think that once out in the woods they can do as they want not thinking of the environment or other hikers.....

[SCRUB HIKER]

I really don't understand the mentality of the OP. The location you describe is not a endangered environment and only has high usage because of AMC and their continuing ability to convince the forest service, among other things, that it is environmentally sound policy to fly in woodchips into the woods by helicopter.

We have human markings all along the trail, first the trail itself, then the blazes, then the leantos and signs, not to mention the environmental disasters of the huts. The trail is littered with evidence of humans where there. Humans sometimes camp and sometimes enjoy a fire, sometimes a celebratory bonfire - we are human that's what we do. There was a good time here, I am happy for them.

Unless you are bound up in rules and regulations, which are hypocritical - as pointed out above, not only live and let live but be happy that people had fun, but at the very least be consistent.

You had me until the part where you said the AMC paints blazes.

Seriously, though, I agree with you. It's hard to be outraged at anyone's LNT-poor behavior in the Whites because the whole area has such a human commercial apparatus built up all over it that it doesn't even feel like wilderness; it feels more like a city park that just happens to be in some mountains. Yeah, some AMC employee has to spend 10 minutes cleaning up this fire pit now, but they've already accounted for that expense with their fee structure which diffuses maintenance/cleanup cost among anyone, LNT-law-abiding or not, who pays to stay at a shelter or hut. They implicitly condone behavior like this by explicitly stating that they expect it when they charge you $8 to pitch your tent at Kinsman Pond or somewhere.

I'll get mad when I see bad campfire ethics in Mt. Rainier NP (as I did on the PCT this year ... someone had just left a fire burning full blaze when they hiked out of their campsite in the morning and it was still roaring when I walked up on it), but I'm not as concerned about it in the Whites because the AMC brings it upon themselves and, as Starchild said, it's not even close to the worst environmental abomination in those woods.

[rickb]

it's not even close to the worst environmental abomination in those woods.

What would the worst environmental abomination in those woods be, then?

My guess is that what ever your answer might be, it is more likely not an environmental abomination at all. But rather an aesthetic one-- at worst. And beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[hikerboy57]

for the record, the trails in question are maintained by the rmc, not the amc.

and building fires in the middle of a trail is just not acceptable.
your answer to over-congestion in the whites is to become part of the problem?

[Many Moons]

If you get them hot enough they melt to nothing, I promise. HIKE ON!!!!


Miller

[Many Moons]

Tin cans that is!

If you get them hot enough they melt to nothing, I promise. HIKE ON!!!!


Miller

[Last Call]

What about beer bottles? Do premium micro-brew beer bottles melt to nothing better than the rot-gut beer bottles?

[Tuckahoe]

for the record, the trails in question are maintained by the rmc, not the amc.

and building fires in the middle of a trail is just not acceptable.
your answer to over-congestion in the whites is to become part of the problem?

Impossible! The AMC is the devil! And I am sure someone will be along to enlighten us on their evils and how this is their fault...

[aficion]

You don't have to be Jack London to know that to build a fire in the middle of the trail is a Bozo No No.

[hikerboy57]

for the record, the trails in question are maintained by the rmc, not the amc.

and building fires in the middle of a trail is just not acceptable.
your answer to over-congestion in the whites is to become part of the problem?

Impossible! The AMC is the devil! And I am sure someone will be along to enlighten us on their evils and how this is their fault...

we're not going to let some simple facts get in the way of a good rant

[FarmerChef]

That's disappointing, really. If you want to make a fire within the rules, I'm fine with that - even encourage that. But right in the middle of the trail? Not cool. I hope that this was a survival situation and someone was lost and out of their senses....probably not