ATC takes official stand on bear canisters

[chknfngrs]

the answer is no they won’t fit it all

[HankIV]

I absolutely do NOT think it's the ATCs responsibility to provide bear boxes/cables; not their job.

It does however seem like a good idea. I agree, hangs are hard and frequently just not possible. I used an Ursack, so I wouldn’t have to think about it, especially coming in to camp in the dark. I guess they get shredded sometimes, mine was never tested. But when there was a bear box, I used it. Seems like a pretty low cost way to greatly reduced the reward for a bear.

I think most thru hikers would use an Ursack vs a canister. Much lighter and the stool utility is low when all you do in camp is eat quick and sleep.

[gpburdelljr]

I wonder how many canisters get rolled off into the woods where the owner can’t find it.

[Miner]

The problem with a canister on top of the pack is poor weight distribution if the canister has a lot of food in it. It’s better to have the heaviest items lower. Some hikers put their food in bags in their pack and then have an empty canister riding on top but that’s also a hassle.

One the PCT, I seen many hikers doing exactly what you describe.

When I need to carry a bear can in my smaller packs (mainly in the Sierra Nevada), I use the small Bear Boxer can (looks like a small Garcia can) which weights 1.6 lbs. The Bear Boxer can often fits in many of the UL packs as the diameter is 7.4 in and the length is 8 in. I can get about 3.5 days worth of food inside one, and any extra has to be hung or put in a bear locker (if available).

Unfortunately, the Wild Ideas carbon fiber cans all use the same too fat diameter which don't fit inside many small packs. I wish they'd make their small size narrower, but I guess their tooling only has 1 diameter and they can just change the length.

[chknfngrs]

Cans are intended for overnight storage if I am not mistaken. When theoretically you can’t fight off a hungry something or other?

[peakbagger]

Cans need to be certain diameter to withstand the crushing action of a bears jaws. The bigger the diameter the thinner the material. If you have ever seen the videos of the bear testing cannisters, the bear is trying to create leverage with a untied cannister and it just pops out of their mouths. Thats why most brands specifically say not to tie the cannister. The bear is an opportunist, they will go after the easiest food stash.

[HankIV]

Maybe someone will come up with “BearShield”; like InsectShield, but for bears.

[LoneStranger]

Just hiked the Long Trail with a Blazer strapped to the top of an SMD Minimalist V2. Been carrying this can on top of this pack and its predecessor for a few years now. No issues with the top load other than it looking funky if it tilts to one side. Rides just fine even while scrambling or bushwhacking. Think it may be blocking the inReach signal, but other than that it just makes sense.

[BillyGr]

It does however seem like a good idea. I agree, hangs are hard and frequently just not possible. I used an Ursack, so I wouldn’t have to think about it, especially coming in to camp in the dark. I guess they get shredded sometimes, mine was never tested. But when there was a bear box, I used it. Seems like a pretty low cost way to greatly reduced the reward for a bear.
I think most thru hikers would use an Ursack vs a canister. Much lighter and the stool utility is low when all you do in camp is eat quick and sleep.

Definitely seems easier for the AT than in other places, given that the camping areas are more confined and used, plus so many already have other "infrastructure" like outhouses and shelters. On other trails, there are more possible places that people will camp, so it would be harder to provide fixed food storage containers. The best option might be to have some type of fixed container for each shelter or main camp site, then those who prefer to (where it is allowed) camp on their own outside these sites would want to have their own food storage option as well.

[peakbagger]

The problem with bear boxes at campsites is folks use them for trash receptacles. They get real ugly unless someone is maintaining them.

[Coffee]

People also use bear boxes to cache food. I've seen that in the Sierra Nevada, especially in SEKI. This has resulted in some boxes being locked by rangers.

[BillyGr]

The problem with bear boxes at campsites is folks use them for trash receptacles. They get real ugly unless someone is maintaining them.

Of course people would put trash in there as well, since that could also attract the bear. Then take it along the next day when they leave. If they don't, that is their issue (just like any other trash left at any site, which also happens many times and shouldn't).

People also use bear boxes to cache food. I've seen that in the Sierra Nevada, especially in SEKI. This has resulted in some boxes being locked by rangers.

That doesn't seem to be an issue, unless they fill the entire thing up, leaving no room for those actually staying there.


One other thought that comes to mind - in the areas where camping is limited to designated sites, there would no longer be a question of what sites are designated or not (since some non-designated ones get used when they shouldn't and begin to look like they are intended for camping) - if they have a box, they are in fact a legitimate camp site (since no one is going to drag a box along), if not then they aren't.

[LazyLightning]

Some of those bear boxes look so nasty inside I wouldn't want to put anything in them without some protection of my own from bugs ect. or even mice, they fit threw anything and some of those have little holes they could squeeze through. I remember finding a hang on parts of the AT because I didn't trust my food bag in the designated container. Also some of the designated cables were a joke they were hanging so low when loaded, I remember opting for my own hang over cables several times as well.

[peakbagger]

Some of those bear boxes look so nasty inside I wouldn't want to put anything in them without some protection of my own from bugs ect. or even mice, they fit threw anything and some of those have little holes they could squeeze through. I remember finding a hang on parts of the AT because I didn't trust my food bag in the designated container. Also some of the designated cables were a joke they were hanging so low when loaded, I remember opting for my own hang over cables several times as well.

That has been my experience, people leave leftover food in there along with trash and inevitably water gets inside and it starts to rot. Add in insects and they can be pretty gross.

[hikermiker]

Unfortunately too many people have no clue about how to do a proper bear bag hang.

[HankIV]

Unfortunately too many people have no clue about how to do a proper bear bag hang.

Unfortunately neither do many trees. It is time to discard hangs as a solution to the bear issue.

You’re right, lots of folk don’t know how. And those that do are frequently challenged by poor branch availability, fading light, snagged throw bags, etc.

I can imagine bear boxes getting used as trash cans, but didn’t see much of that myself last summer.

[CalebJ]

Unfortunately neither do many trees. It is time to discard hangs as a solution to the bear issue.

You’re right, lots of folk don’t know how. And those that do are frequently challenged by poor branch availability, fading light, snagged throw bags, etc.

I can imagine bear boxes getting used as trash cans, but didn’t see much of that myself last summer.

I made the point in a non-WB discussion that there are numerous places along the AT where a 'proper' PCT hang is not possible and was immediately called out by several people who swore up and down that they'd never seen such a place anywhere.

I'm not sure if they were just lucky or incapable of recognizing a bad hang when they saw one. But certainly on many of my trips there have been places where you couldn't actually hang at an appropriate height and separation from the trunk to adequately protect the bag.

A canister isn't in my kit yet, but the time is coming very quickly.

[Mockernut]

There are definitely places where a suitable tree or trees is near impossible to find....or at least near enough to your campsite to be reasonable.

[Coffee]

Some of those bear boxes look so nasty inside I wouldn't want to put anything in them without some protection of my own from bugs ect. or even mice, they fit threw anything and some of those have little holes they could squeeze through. I remember finding a hang on parts of the AT because I didn't trust my food bag in the designated container. Also some of the designated cables were a joke they were hanging so low when loaded, I remember opting for my own hang over cables several times as well.

That's true. At a shelter in SNP one time, the bear box had an oder to it that seemed gross so I hung my back on the bear pole instead.

[Deacon]

I made the point in a non-WB discussion that there are numerous places along the AT where a 'proper' PCT hang is not possible and was immediately called out by several people who swore up and down that they'd never seen such a place anywhere.

I'm not sure if they were just lucky or incapable of recognizing a bad hang when they saw one. But certainly on many of my trips there have been places where you couldn't actually hang at an appropriate height and separation from the trunk to adequately protect the bag.

A canister isn't in my kit yet, but the time is coming very quickly.

This is true. The stretch in North Carolina north of the Smokys is such a place. I swear, the lowest branches are a hundred feet up.


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